Well I did it.

[Jack19]

After a couple years of being Uzi-less....I ordered two today from Atlantic Firearms. Have to get the check and the FFL in the mail on Friday...but at least I know they're out there. :twoguns

I'm looking forward to getting them more than I am Christmas. LOL

[Deadline222]

Why TWO? :)

[Jack19]

Well in my Uzi euphoria...I apprear to have become dyslexic. :jester

[gary tuthill]

Why TWO? :)that's silly...one for each hand...:m16s

[firefighter]

Well in my Uzi euphoria...I apprear to have become dyslexic. :jester

I sometimes get turned around as to what dyslexic means.... :bang

What 2 did you order? A full size and a mini?
Santa is coming early. :)

[Jack19]

I ordered two full size.

I live in an unfriendly state and as much as I would like a Mini, the local CLEO refuses to sign paperwork for anyone; so, no SBR. At least with the full size I can cover the barrel up with one of the AA shrouds from Numrich.

I like the full size anyway. I've owned two IMIs and a Vector in the past. Miss them badly.

[firefighter]

I ordered two full size.

I live in an unfriendly state and as much as I would like a Mini, the local CLEO refuses to sign paperwork for anyone; so, no SBR. At least with the full size I can cover the barrel up with one of the AA shrouds from Numrich.

I like the full size anyway. I've owned two IMIs and a Vector in the past. Miss them badly.

You ordered 2 full size carbines then, right?
A mini carbine is no different then. It's just a smaller frame than than the full size, but it has a 19" barrel so satisfy the 26" over all length issue.

I live in an unfriendly state too, and have a full size, mini, and an Uzi pistol.
No SBR's here either.
Why does the local CLEO have to sign off on anything?

[MuzzleFlash]

...Why does the local CLEO have to sign off on anything? Many years back, the ATF added this requirement to process the NFA transfer and making forms. It's part of the impediment they created to discourage people from getting Title 2 weapons. It has no basis in any federal statute. It's a requirement made up of whole cloth. Unfortunately, no court has seen fit to toss it out for what it is - an extralegal attempt to suppress the free exercise of second amendment rights.

Someday they'll require a wifey and bonehead neighbor sign-off too.

So Jack19, if there is no state or local laws to the contrary (just the anti-gun CLEO), you could SBR them on a partnership/trust/LLC. No fingerprints, no passport photos and best of all, no CLEO hassles.

[firefighter]

But we're talking about semi auto carbines here right?

In North Carolina you have to have a CLEO sign off to get a semi auto?

[az paul]

Congrats on your acquisitions. You'll love 'em!!

[Jack19]

firefighter, in NC I have to obtain the CLEO's signature if I want to SBR a rifle/carbine. Here in Mecklenburg County, our fine Sheriff won't sign anything.

[firefighter]

I think I understand...I was most likely just reading too much into it.

Congrats on your two new Uzi's!!!

What a Merry Christmas you'll be having. :banana

[johninocala]

Yes, Merry Christmas and a very Happy New Year!

[tacdrivrnc]

hey, another north carolinian with an uzi...what the hell...

so, now you need a .22 kit so you can shoot them cheaper...

if you PM me I think I can help with that

[M1A....]

Congrats & Happy Holidays!!! Now go tell Santa to bring me a couple too!!!:jester

[ArevaloSOCOM]

Just so you know, you don't need some anti-gun CLEO sign off to make your SBR.

Do you have a computer?

Do you have 50 bucks?

Can you make it to a local Office Depot and buy a bopy of Willmaker 2006/2007.

If so..................

Then do the above and create a "revocalbe living trust".

It doesn't have to have any assets in it at all..................just be a legal document once notorized.

I did this and 12 days later I had my silencer without having to beg some iodiot to sign off, getting fingerprinted, or that certificate or whatevere it's called proving your an american or what not.


:)

[tacdrivrnc]

is that anything like the "sally struthers ho-made class III correspondence course"?

never heard of this happy-crappy....details, man, details....

pm me if you don't want to post it all

[Sayeret Shaldag]

ArevaloSOCOM thanks for the advice. I have been hearing quite a bit about this revocable living trust and I planning on doing it.

[ArevaloSOCOM]

Slight hijack for the good of Uzi Talk memeber not wanting to have to explina themselves to anti-gun CLEO's.

A trust is a legal entity.

If you look on a 4473, you'll see that a Trust is mentioned as a "entitiy" that can buy guns.

Silencers, MG's, and SBR's are guns.

Thus..............create a "Revocable Living Trust".

It costs 50 bucks if you go buy "Quiken Willmaker 2007".

It's a SUPER easy program that asks you Q's and with your Answers fills in a Trust.

Then you and one more pseron, if you are married or trust someone else, can then be the "Trustees" of the Trust.

That means you can control everything in there & so can the other person if you choose to have 2 Trustees.

You/Both go and get a copy of that Trust, after you print it out, to get notrized.

Then it's "a legal entity".

Thus is can own property, in this case......................guns.

The benefit to you are:

No CLEO bullshit.

No fingerprinting bullshit.

No Mugshot bullshit.

No (forgive me as the "offical" name escapses me ) Citizneship proof form bullshit.

FASTER trunaround times at the ATF since your above mentioned crap doesn't get sent it anymore, thus you don't have to wait for the FBI crap.






Believe it.

I sent mine in for a silencer, 12 days later.......................I had it on my gun.

:)

what was in my envelope to the BATFE?


a 200 buck check made out to the BATFE.

2 copies of my From 4

A copy of my Trust.





that's it.

[Sayeret Shaldag]

Thanks again for sharing Arevalo.:waving

[Jack19]

Arevalo, you the man.

After the first of the year. I'm giving it a shot. (No pun intended.) :patriot

[Nicotine]

I think the mods should make a sticky detailing the "living Trust" process.

Awesome! I am going to try to get my MAC SBRed using this method, then if it works, a silencer. Awesome, simply awesome. for many, I think the CLEO issue was the biggest problem.

[RoverDave]

I think the mods should make a sticky detailing the "living Trust" process.

I'll add it to the info in the library about buying an NFA weapon.

[Nicotine]

I'll add it to the info in the library about buying an NFA weapon.
Again, AWESOME! Thanks.

[watchin]

Again, some state laws trump Federal laws. I know it sounds wrong (and IMHO is wrong) but, nonetheless, that's the way it is. I would make sure that this sticky has a caveat that your mileage may vary with regards to success.
-watchin-

[ArevaloSOCOM]

Again, some state laws trump Federal laws. I know it sounds wrong (and IMHO is wrong) but, nonetheless, that's the way it is. I would make sure that this sticky has a caveat that your mileage may vary with regards to success.
-watchin-

Do you mean to sya that a Trust might not work in some states?

Do you have a link for this?

LLC's and Trust's are legal in all 50 states.

If anything would stop you it would be states allowing SBRs, SBS, silencers, etc..........

only a state law on types of guns allowed would stop a Trust owner.

Trust me.

:)

[Oswald2001]

ArevaloSOCOM,

Thanks for bringing up the 'Trust Issue'.

(Don't we all have 'Trust Issues'? :jester )

I have had a Kalifornia LLC and also a S Corp.. In Kali, they want $800/year for each entity.

I have sent away for the software you posted about. I may try a trust in Nevada.



This is a very cool site. You can learn just about anything here.

[cohutt]

Do you mean to sya that a Trust might not work in some states?

Do you have a link for this?

LLC's and Trust's are legal in all 50 states.

If anything would stop you it would be states allowing SBRs, SBS, silencers, etc..........

only a state law on types of guns allowed would stop a Trust owner.

Trust me.

:)

Saved this one a while back.

http://sigforum.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/630601935/m/669101014/p/1

[ArevaloSOCOM]

Saved this one a while back.

http://sigforum.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/630601935/m/669101014/p/1


I assume you proved this link as info, not to say that a Trust was not approved in a certain state.

I scanned through it and didn't see wnything of the sort, I did enjoy reading all the other people who did it and saw it for themselves.

:)

[ArevaloSOCOM]

ArevaloSOCOM,

Thanks for bringing up the 'Trust Issue'.

(Don't we all have 'Trust Issues'? :jester )

I have had a Kalifornia LLC and also a S Corp.. In Kali, they want $800/year for each entity.

I have sent away for the software you posted about. I may try a trust in Nevada.



This is a very cool site. You can learn just about anything here.

just so you are aware, Trust are legal in all 50 states, but the primary residence of the itmes in the Trust must be legal in said state.

In other words, you wouldn't be able to buy cans and MG's while living in Cali just b/c your Trust was made in Nevada. UNLESS the other Trustee lived in Nevada...............then you could.

:)

[Nicotine]

Found this, if anyone wants to look over the paper work. I have to say, I am VERY excited about this.
TRUST DOCUMENT (http://www.ilrg.com/forms/trustrev.html)

Quik question though, say I own a carbine, and want to SBR it. Do I need to "transfer" the gun to a class3 first and have him do the work, then transfer to the trust, or can I just transfer the carbine to the trust and have it modified in the trusts name?

[watchin]

Arevalosocom, I think we are saying the same thing. If the state you live in does not allow for the possession of a MG or can you MIGHT have a problem with the trust covering it. I am not a lawyer or a judge but in all the movies and real life experiences I have had I have never heard of "a link to it" being any kind of legal defense. If my lawyer told me 'no problem..you're fine, we will have you out of here in a few days..I just sent a link to the judge so she will know that she is in the wrong", I would start getting worried.
-watchin-

[ArevaloSOCOM]

Arevalosocom, I think we are saying the same thing. If the state you live in does not allow for the possession of a MG or can you MIGHT have a problem with the trust covering it. I am not a lawyer or a judge but in all the movies and real life experiences I have had I have never heard of "a link to it" being any kind of legal defense. If my lawyer told me 'no problem..you're fine, we will have you out of here in a few days..I just sent a link to the judge so she will know that she is in the wrong", I would start getting worried.
-watchin-

Agreed, same page.

As long as it's legal in your state, you can have it in your Trust.

[ArevaloSOCOM]

Found this, if anyone wants to look over the paper work. I have to say, I am VERY excited about this.
TRUST DOCUMENT (http://www.ilrg.com/forms/trustrev.html)

Quik question though, say I own a carbine, and want to SBR it. Do I need to "transfer" the gun to a class3 first and have him do the work, then transfer to the trust, or can I just transfer the carbine to the trust and have it modified in the trusts name?

FIRST, do a Form 1

Get an approved Form 1 BACK, then get the barrel cut.

You alos have to engrave the owner's name on the lower.

"Your name's Trust" on the lower.

:)

[BlackTen]

Ok, so I bought Quicken Willmaker and created a basic revocable living trust. Once I have it notarized, what's the next step in purchasing a MG? I just ordered form 4 from the ATF. Will I need to know the exact firearm I'm purchasing to fill out form 4? Thanks for your help.

[Fr8 Dawg]

Yea, fuck em. I do the LLC thing...makes life a lot easier.

I ran two machine guns and a suppressor through the chief as a courtesy to those who nurtured this situation with a signing CLEO, but every thing since then has been LLC.

[a1autoins]

So Jack19, if there is no state or local laws to the contrary (just the anti-gun CLEO), you could SBR them on a partnership/trust/LLC. No fingerprints, no passport photos and best of all, no CLEO hassles.[/QUOTE]


How can you SBR with a corp without CLEO??

[Sayeret Shaldag]

OK so me and my buddy are going to buy this trust document off the web from the above link. I will have a lawyer look it over and ammend it as necessary. Should I just transfer all my guns into this trust? How do you guys do it? Just the NFA stuff or everything? I figure why not put all my guns in there.

What kinds of forms are needed to transfer weapons you already own into the trust if they are semi pistols and rifles?

This is all pretty new to me so any advice is appreciated.

UPDATE** Ok we already have a trust. Wow that was quick. We still need to get it signed, notorzied, & ammended, but we are on our way.

Can't we just buy anything we want and have it sit at the dealer until our (the trust's) papers come through?
Where does one buy a dummy's guide to purchasing suppressors and NFA weps.? Ahh..we have you guys.:silly

Ten I hope you ordered two form 4s:slap Man I am gonna have to go back on a matzah diet to afford this stuff.

[RBMG]

I am the attorney who wrote the recent article in small arms review regaridng using trusts for NFA. The best advice I can give you is ditch whatever document you got off the web and pay a qualified attorney to prepare the trust correctly the first time. I see you are in miami. I am in Plantation, FL. If you have any specific questions on trusts in Florida, let me know.

Bob, Esq./FFL/SOT

[Sayeret Shaldag]

Two Questions For Starters:

Should I just transfer all my guns into this trust? How do you guys do it? Just the NFA stuff or everything? I figure why not put all my guns in there.

What kinds of forms/ documentation is needed to transfer weapons you already own into the trust if they are semi pistols and rifles?

[Jack19]

I consider it my honor to have my thread hijacked for such a noble cause.