What make a Daniel Defense, Bravo Co. Larue, etc. Upper and/or lower more desirable than a DPMS, Rock River, etc.? It seems that to get a DD complete upper it costs a couple of hundred more than a DPMS. Why?
What make a Daniel Defense, Bravo Co. Larue, etc. Upper and/or lower more desirable than a DPMS, Rock River, etc.? It seems that to get a DD complete upper it costs a couple of hundred more than a DPMS. Why?
It's in the details, for instance the DD bolts are individually MPI tested whereas the DPMS ones are batch processed.
Quality is the main reason, however some of it Brand Name pricing. Heres a few things that are some times differant between cheap and high end uppers/ guns.
Non or poorly staked gas keys.
No Parkerizing under the FSB.
Not staking the castle nut.
NON MPI or Batch Tested MPI
cheaper less powerful extractor spings / D ring upgrades comes standard on some higher end guns
H2 Type buffers instead of the standard CAR buffers
Crappy MIM fire controls
Chrome lining
Larue, DD, Vltor all charge a fair price for their FF systems compared to the cheaper YHM / UTG type stuff. That normally opens the gap a fair amount.
Email:
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Mostly you're paying for QC.
Bear in mind that all mfgs have occasional qc issues but:
DPMS for example has terrible quality control and fit/finish and also lower grade of aluminum used in its receivers than any other major mfg.
Rock River Arms are great but they typically use 1/9 twist rates which are less ideal for heavier bullets. RRA also does not do some of the milspec extras mentioned above.
The cliche "you get what you pay for" is clearly applicable. My first AR was a S&W M&P15 when they first came out. It has a DPMS barrel installed at the factory. Most companies outsource a lot of parts so quality of parts can be a big deal. My Brother In Law's wife has a brother in Dallas (complicated) that builds AR15 receivers for all of the major companies. He has ten CNC machines turning them out.
I now have various numbers of Colt, Noveske, Daniel Defense and BravoCompany. Also a few Rock Rivers AR15s so I have a good comparison of different builds. To be candid, for recreational shooting the MP15 does just fine next to the more expensive guns and I keep it in the barn for a ready gun. However my truck gun is a SBR I assembled myself from top tier parts with a Bravo Company Kino style SBR upper, if I ever have to count on a AR15 for a serious response it will either be the truck gun or a Noveske SBR I keep in the house. I just bought a DD Mk18 from this board to build another high quality SBR AR15.
---I get peace of mind from the higher tier guns, even though with my older eyes, I gotta have a red dot or scope to shoot accurate past 100 yds.
My hog hunting AR15 is a suppressed Noveske with switchblock gas block. My longer range varmit shooter is a Rock River Predator Pursuit. I shoot about the same with all of the AR15s, however the Rock River Predator Pursuit is scary accurate. I bought the Colt 6920 because I used to always want a Colt AR but was still raising kids that were college bound and couldn't afford one. Now the kids are grown, prices dropped very low on Colts, so added one to the pile.
What drives up the cost is Quality of Parts and QC of assembly.
-Colt is the standard for AR15 every other AR is measured against.
- Barrel cost. Daniel Defense makes a great barrel, Noveske makes an excellent barrel. I shoot just as good with the DPMS barrel, I'm the limiting factor.
- Extension Tube. Cheaper ones are extruded, softer, and have been known to fold.
-BCG assembly QC. Staking is poor, my MP15 staking didn't even come close to the set screws.
-lower parts kit, all of the little parts in the lower. Trigger parts are the most critical. I swapped out most of my triggers for Giesselle, I like them.
-overall assembly QC. Noveske, Daniel Defense, and BravoCompany (BCM) are noted for quality control.
- Accessories such as flip up sight quality, type of stock, etc.
IMO, you wont go wrong with a lower price AR15 like DPMS or Stag if that's all your budget can afford and you're just shooting paper. If you can afford it, step up to a Bravo Company build. Try G&R Tactical, I think they usually have Bravo Company rifles in stock. http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...&key=MID-750-C. If you have a few extra bucks, you will certainly get an excellent rifle if is made by COLT, NOVESKE, or DANIEL DEFENSE.
have fun,
RFA
Last edited by Ready.Fire.Aim; 09-24-2012 at 07:41 PM.
"Jill, if there's ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony ... take that double-barrel shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house,.." VP Joe Biden Feb 19, 2013
I've learned to stay away from the CMMG stuff.
So glad I'll be able to make all my own uppers/lowers now to my liking.
Thanks for the replies. I have a Colt SP1 and a DPMS AP4 thath I have been quite happy with and built 4 others last year using DPMS uppers and barrels, RR lower, Nodak Spud retro lowers , H&R and an R-guns lower. I'm pleased with those as well, but was thinking of a DD, Vltor, or Bravo co. uppers and I'm not sure what brand lower. It sounds like I haven't done to bad in my choices so far, but I've had so much fun with those that I'd like to build a really greatquality AR, most likely a DI type upper.
So you are much more advanced and know a lot more about AR15 then your typical trigger puller!Originally Posted by swood40215
- I suggest you look up Noveske, at least for the barrel.
-Quality lower parts kits (LPK) are currently very hard to find. DPMS, etc are available at MidwayUSA and Brownells had some Colt LPK for double the $$. I found top quality LPK kits at G&R tactical. They will exclude or include trigger parts and trigger guard at your choice. I chose the option with a Geisselle SSA trigger and Magpul trigger guard. http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...on&key=GRT-LPK
Do look into the VLTOR A5 stock system. I just got one for a 10.5" SBR I am building. Lots of positive results on it.
I do like Bravo Company's parts selection. As far as the rest of the parts, have fun.
RFA
Last edited by Ready.Fire.Aim; 09-25-2012 at 12:24 AM.
"Jill, if there's ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony ... take that double-barrel shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house,.." VP Joe Biden Feb 19, 2013
Thanks for the recommendation on G&R. I ordered a Braco Co. 14.5 M4 upper w/ a pinned A2x flash hider and BCM bcg from them and screwed up the order but didn't realize it until I reviewed the invoice. A quick call to them straightened it out. Hopefully the call and e-mail just seconds after I placed the order got it fixed. I'll find out on Friday.
My first AR purchased 30 years ago is a PWA lower build on mix matched parts - still is one the best shooting AR's of my collection. I think the newer mass produced parts do lack quality control, though.
Are the PSA uppers any good? Looking for something to throw on my RR.
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