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Thread: Why Me?

  1. #1
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    Why Me?

    My long awaited Lage .22 kit arrived. Fit and finish are great. Unfortunately the mags not so much. I have a very nice 0-6 round burst piece of equipment. Main problem is that the follower fails to lift the cartridge up into position. Also have problems with poor feed angle. Clearly I am in the minority because of the all of the good reviews I have read and the videos of these things running well. If it wasn't for that I'd say this this thing is a gimmick. My current plan is to buy a couple more mags to steal the springs so that i can double up on them (i can spin up a nice little connector on the lathe) but i feel cheated having to do that. Any recommendations? Also, just to get this out of the way I am using golden bullets, graphite lube, a loader, I don't have rim lock, the mag is seated, and i spent some quality time cycling the follower with a brass rod to break it in. Any advise would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


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  2. #2
    Registered User LawBob's Avatar
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    Are you using the mag loader? You don’t want the 22 rims to get caught on the one below.

  3. #3
    Registered User LawBob's Avatar
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    What ammo also. I used Winchester m22 on a binary trigger ar22 setup, and it had a crimp in the middle of the brass- no bueno. It would jamomatic. Try cci mini mags.

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    If you ever need an extractor or striker (or any parts) for that FTL Auto Nine, I've got them

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    Do you have to exert excess upward force to lock the mags in?

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    How many magazines have you tried

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    The biggest problem with the function of the kit is rim stacking in the straight body mags. If a cartridge rim gets behind the rim of a previously loaded cartridge rim, the cartridges stop feeding up the mag body and/or jam and bend at the feed ramp. An easy way to check for rim stacking is to look at the angle of the loaded cartridges periodically during loading the mag. The cartridges should not be perpendicular to the mag body. They should be at an angle. If a cartridge is perpendicular to the feed lips, stop loading. Unload the cartridges until the rim stacked cartridge is found and reloaded.

    Richard has 7 steps for loading the mags in his M-11/22 manual. Do not neglect the process or frustration is imminent.

    Last edited by strobro32; 02-11-2020 at 07:46 PM.

  8. #8
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    This mag should never have been made in opaque black polymer.
    My name is actually Scott and I really do live in Texas.

    I know, not very creative but it is factual.

    By the way - Facebook is truly evil; resist the urge to participate.

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    First of all guys, I want to say that I really appreciate the help. I have been a fly on the wall here for six or seven years but just now jumped into the conversation. As to the questions: I am using golden bullets, a loader, and the mag is seated. I have two magazines that I am using (I was planning to order more but I'm not going to spend the money if I can't get these working). I strongly doubt that the primary problem is rim lock because 2/3 of the time after a ftf i can pull the bolt back and the next round isn't even pushed up against the feed lips. A sharp smack or two against the bottom of the mag will proceed to get me operational for another 1-6ish rounds but then i am back in the same situation.

  10. #10
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    The scenario you described happens to me when I'm out shooting mine in temperatures around 20 deg and below. Are you in a cold climate?

  11. #11
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    Rim lock can cause the follower and cartridges to fail to elevate and therefore fail to feed.

    As Strobro says, you have to check the angle and if you encounter strong resistance when loading, stop and assess. You probably have rim lock.

    I actually load each of my 10 mags manually for just this reason. The McFadden loader doesn’t work for me.

    Loading Keltec CP33 and PMR30 mags has taught me to be careful about pushing a loaded cartridge down to assist loading the next. If not careful you tend to push the rim end down which often allows the top round to slide over and rim lock.

    I try to push the rim of the new cartridge down into the groove of the feed lips as far forward as possible then slide the cartridge down to its normal seated position. If you just jam them down it seems to screw up your proper orientation and you create rimlock deep in the stack sometimes.

    It appears 1986 guns are worse than earlier guns; specs got sloppy and you may have trouble getting the kit to work reliably. I have and I’ve tried a lot of things.
    My name is actually Scott and I really do live in Texas.

    I know, not very creative but it is factual.

    By the way - Facebook is truly evil; resist the urge to participate.

  12. #12
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    Another point: compared to virtually every other .22 magazine these M11/22 and Keltec mags have a much smaller feed angle. You almost cannot rimlock a S&W M 41 or any Ruger 10 rd mag. Push the follower all the way down and drop in rounds and they tend to fall in place with no rimlock.

    Not so the KelTec and M11/22 mags.
    My name is actually Scott and I really do live in Texas.

    I know, not very creative but it is factual.

    By the way - Facebook is truly evil; resist the urge to participate.

  13. #13
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    SMEC_289 Please try what everyone has recommended. If that doesn’t work, send us your .22 kit upper and Mag’s back and we will figure it out for free.
    Richard Lage
    Lage Manufacturing, L.L.C.
    www.max-11.com

  14. #14
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    I woulda called Lage first

  15. #15
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    I missed the part where you disassembled the magazines and inspected for burs or excess sprew from the mold.
    Please visit my FB page for the latest CF-W bolt information.
    https://www.facebook.com/VegasSMG/?ref

  16. #16
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    Nice pic. If you play around with the Ingram+SWD family of guns long enough you find things that aren't quite fitting or working just right. Stuff like a certain upper being a little loose and needing a shim, or you find out there is something out of tolerance with your gun, or it's the trip, the ammo, or the magazines.

    Almost every time I've run into a roadblock the problem turned out to be something other than the Lage accessory that was in the mix. The one time I did have an issue with a Lage component it was just from excessive wear and was repaired for free, with free return shipping. So in this case I think it's more Lucky you than Why me because you're going to be taken care of my friend

    Here is my current order of opperations when something isn't running well
    1. Ammo
    2. Magazines
    3. barrel allignment / bolt rubbing

    I'm personally in possession of a .22 upper that I haven't had the pleasure to shoot yet, but I'm still comfortable suggesting you used the Lage recommended CCI mini-mags and triple check your mag loading. Also, regarding your follower looking stuck, it would seem like that could be rimlock, I really don't know, but my next move would be to polish the mag body and the follower before increasing spring pressure. Too much spring pressure can make it hard for the bolt to strip the top rounds off of a full magazine.
    Last edited by Gaujo; 02-11-2020 at 01:25 PM.

  17. #17
    Registered User LawBob's Avatar
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    By change did you break the legs on the follower?

  18. #18
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    You can eliminate the mag spring tension as a cause by loading only 10 or so rounds. If it runs, that was it. If not, it wasn’t.
    Live BRAVE, Live FREE!

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    Sure, there are all the Lage Uppers, the CF-W Bolt, the UltiMac, a 12 gauge upper, and the Tenkko Adapter but let me now present this small brass thing I made to increase spring tension. I even strategically pictured it with a harbor freight micrometer to imply that I had some sort of machinist skill. Actually though, before I go test this out I am going to try some of the fine ideas recommended by this community. With this type of support the tuning really is an enjoyable part of ownership. This is an '86 and when I purchased it I had to work down the trip because it was NIB so I don't mind some light tinkering.

    In response to specific questions:

    Mr. MackJack - temp was about 30 degrees, I'm in Indiana

    Mr. ScottinTexas - never considered rimlock to hold up the follower so that could be the case but I hand loaded with the supplied loader and tried awful hard not to lock them

    Mr. Lage - your reputation for service after the sale is stellar so if I have to admit defeat I'm sure you can get it figured out

    Mr. Gaffshot - probably should have called first, just kinda wanted to see if I could get it worked out myself

    Mr. Vegas SMG - I didn't say it but yes, I did dissembled and take a look, nothing seemed evident that would hang it up

    Mr. Gaujo - I can polish the body or follower but it seems pretty smooth to me. Also, CCI has made some of my picky eater rimfires happy (like my browning ATD that only will digest stingers) but I was hoping to shoot cheap golden bullets. Also I bought 20,000 in advance...

    Mr. LawBob - Firstly, if you are a grammar Nazi I apologize in advance for my spelling and grammatical structure. Secondly, no legs broken.

    Mr. Rybread - I'll give that a try, nice and simple thing to do.

    Ok thanks folks, I'll try these things out when I get the chance but probably not tonight as there are only so many nights I want to drive out in the country to my parents vacant lot and shoot an smg into the ground beside the road while back lit by the headlights of my crown vick with the Indiana the sleet coming down. I feel it could look bad to a passerby. And it's cold.
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  20. #20
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    Oh, and Mr. strobro32 thanks for the diagram. I did read the owners manual which I think was about the only one I have ever read. Thank you for the diagram, I will compare next time I load.

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