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Thread: Bullpup MAC10-22

  1. #21
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    That looks good - love it.


    It’s 2021. If you want something, make it yourself.
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  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by mak91 View Post
    With all the political nonsense, crappy winter weather and a raging virus in an effort to keep from going insane I have pretty much locked myself in my man cave and decided to work on some things I have always wanted. One project was this, a dedicated 22lr upper for my m11. Since anything with its own mag well will need the blessing of the atf I decided to use something that would fit in the existing mag well of the m11, Richard's 40 round 22lr mag. I've finished the 3d models and 3d printed a prototype. May not mean much but I can cycle rounds by hand so I think its a good sign. Just started the process of making hard parts to see if it will really run. I designed the bolt to where it should also work in the smaller m11 with the larger mag well. At some point I'll see for the m10 if Richard's mag will work using the mag well insert already available. If it does than I am sure something could be made for it as well. One step at a time. As always I am open to partnering on development.
    Looks good.
    I’ve been working on one for an m11 with a forward mag well (10/22) but have been running into problems with 3d printing modeling (cad) programs. It’s me not the programs (I need a lot more time with the programs).


    You eluded to a forward mag well needing atf approval. I personally don’t think they’ll be approving anything new with a forward mag well. I don’t know how they approved any of them with the Tenko response / decision (which I think he got that awhile ago). You can have a loaded mag with no lower, pull the bolt back, keep the rear of the upper against your chest and let the bolt go (slamfire) and it’ll run till it’s out of ammo, jams or u stop it.
    I really think the good old days are behind us with new things (using non factory mag well) coming out for the Mac series of weapons; however, time will tell if I’m right (I hope I’m not though). Maybe with a new admin, things might likely change (I doubt it though).

  3. #23
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    I agree we all need a 3D printer, I’m in the market for a higher quality one. Files are out there, and the hard work is already done, you can take the various components (mounting rails, uppers, lowers, AR grip mounts) all you have to do it cut and paste em where you want them. If you’re not into 3D printing you’re not really into guns these days!

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    Would it be possible to just copy a 10/22 receiver, turn it on its side and add a catch for the Mac receiver to interface with?
    Bonus points if it ejects down and out of the magwell.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uniquesnd View Post
    Would it be possible to just copy a 10/22 receiver, turn it on its side and add a catch for the Mac receiver to interface with?
    Bonus points if it ejects down and out of the magwell.
    I’ve been waiting for the 80% 10/22 receivers to be back in stock for just that.
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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by rybread View Post
    I’ve been waiting for the 80% 10/22 receivers to be back in stock for just that.
    These guys have some 80% Rugers: https://www.tacticalinc.com/catalog/product/id-3899

  7. #27
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    Hey look at that- the one I wanted was in stock when selected (unfinished) thanks Skoda!
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    Not meaning to hijack the thread but since its related to the m10. I have also been sitting on this for awhile, waiting to see what goes on with the current atf determinations before moving forward. Again 3d models finished and 3d printed prototype that cycles ammo by hand. 308 nato for the fat mac using lr308 /sr25 mags and parts.
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by strobro32 View Post
    Yesssssss
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    [/QUOTE]

    In my humble uneducated opinion there's a lot more money and interest (at least on my part) in converting American 180 drums to work with the already available 22 kits from Lage. You don't have to reinvent the wheel and you will get repeat business since you would be able to sell multiple drums to an individual like myself. To my knowledge the people making these drum conversions that fit in standard mag wells aren't doing it anymore or are out of business.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by mak91 View Post
    With all the political nonsense, crappy winter weather and a raging virus in an effort to keep from going insane I have pretty much locked myself in my man cave and decided to work on some things I have always wanted. One project was this, a dedicated 22lr upper for my m11. Since anything with its own mag well will need the blessing of the atf I decided to use something that would fit in the existing mag well of the m11, Richard's 40 round 22lr mag. I've finished the 3d models and 3d printed a prototype. May not mean much but I can cycle rounds by hand so I think its a good sign. Just started the process of making hard parts to see if it will really run. I designed the bolt to where it should also work in the smaller m11 with the larger mag well. At some point I'll see for the m10 if Richard's mag will work using the mag well insert already available. If it does than I am sure something could be made for it as well. One step at a time. As always I am open to partnering on development.
    That looks like what we've needed for quite some time.

  13. #33
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    What I would like to see is a 3D printed 32 round Lage/BDM 22 magazine that fits the M11A1 small grip. Then I would not have to modify HK 270 mags.

    I could use a few of those for my M-11A1/22 kit.

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    Love this thread, and all the ingenuity, will be following. I'm starting to tinker myself, inspired by many of you. A reliable 22lr upper is very high on my list of wants. I will pay more for the reliability of the upper and with mags that are reliable. Buy once cry once. There is just something about shooting 22 FA that is a ton of fun.

  15. #35
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    Please join me in lobbying the mods for a 3D printing forum to be added.
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  17. #37
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    “In order to combat illegal 3D printing”

    No one is advocating anything illegal here. If you saw my post asking in the members section I specified “design ideas, software and Hardware” for making uppers (not receivers) and explicitly excluded the transfer of any intellectual content - to avoid such liabilities. If those rules were enforced it’s not functionally different then all of the threads for all the uppers we’ve built. We just made them with metal, instead of plastic.
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  18. #38
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    Your allowed to make your own firearms, parts and accessories. Nothing illegal about it.

    If they go after someone for printing something, they’ll run into more than just 2A issues.


    Thank god for the constitution but let’s be honest anything’s possible with the atf and THIS admin. There is precedent though, even the US had to settle with Defense Distributed, they got paid by the gov and the gov said they could share their files. The US government even said they (the gov) would lose if it went to court.

  19. #39
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    There is nothing wrong with self made parts, 3D or traditional machining. Just learn where the line is and don't go over it.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by rybread View Post
    “In order to combat illegal 3D printing”

    No one is advocating anything illegal here. If you saw my post asking in the members section I specified “design ideas, software and Hardware” for making uppers (not receivers) and explicitly excluded the transfer of any intellectual content - to avoid such liabilities. If those rules were enforced it’s not functionally different then all of the threads for all the uppers we’ve built. We just made them with metal, instead of plastic.
    You posted on another thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by rybread View Post
    Agree.. but that dictates the commercial production domain. If you’re not seeking commercial production, you can build your own “ATF Determination submission Sample prototype upper” at home and “test” it until the cows come home with your RR. 3D files are easily shared- or bought and sold. I would have paid $700 for a Tenco STL file (pre-determination) and signed a contract to not share it. Of course that ship has now long sailed... We should have a 3D forum here on UT (HELLO MODERATORS??). Let’s do some community development here, rather than provide designs to the ATF to ruin forever (see tenco).

    Forward magwells. bullpup frames, .22 uppers- whatever you can imagine...
    This is the way.
    The law is the same whether commercial production or something that you build yourself. Did the Tenko adapter get screwed over by the Tech Branch? Absolutely, but the only difference between something you build for yourself and sell commercially is how much exposure the item gets such that the BATF&E could become aware of it.

    Maybe you don't think of it as illegal but "you can build your own “ATF Determination submission Sample prototype upper” at home and “test” it until the cows come home with your RR. " certainly sounds like going around the law to me. My understanding is that the Executive Branch oversees the Enforcement of the laws Congress writes. If there is a question as to how the Executive Branch enforces the law, the Judiciary clarifies. It is my understanding that everything firearm related is supposed to get a determination as to whether the item is regulated under the NFA or the GCA of '68. Is every firearm related product submitted? No, but the items that contain any of the parts listed in the definition of "firearm " probably should be. I think it is fair to say I am on the conservative side. I was quoted a "ballpark" figure of $100,000.00 and two years for appeals to sue the ATF. How much would defending yourself in Federal court against a charge of owning a Post Sample machinegun cost? I don't know, but I bet it would be more than I have invested in my entire firearms collection.

    You certainly are a reasonably knowledgeable person. But it is my understanding that you are not a lawyer. I certainly am not. That is why I submitted to the FATD. Personally I don't care what you build or do for yourself. But advocating that this site facilitate members going around the law is beyond irresponsible. I feel very fortunate to have access to this site. There are some great members and I have learned a lot here. Such a "3D forum" could get this whole site shut down. If that is what you want to do, please go somewhere else to do it. This is just my opinion.

    Scott

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