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Thread: m11/9 fleming .22 upper rework

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    m11/9 fleming .22 upper rework

    Can anyone get these running right? iíve read some threads on here that indicated someone a few years ago doing so, but not sure if they still are.

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    It can be done if you have patience and dont get easily frustrated

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    I had trouble with mine when I first got it. I read about all of the modifications here and other places which didn't sit well with me; things like opening the ejection port a bunch more. So I messed around for a while with little luck. Then I read somewhere that Fleming designed it to use the cheap Ramline magazines - which apparently is stated in the owners manual. It seems that the Ramline magazine is different in that it has an ejector rib on it that most other magazines don't. I never tried the Ramline magazines that I had because I assumed that if it didn't work with the expensive magazines then it wouldn't work with the cheap ones. Bad assumption. I also found that having a suppressor or muzzle compensator/booster helped a lot also. The only other change that I made was a better extractor. Now it runs almost as well as my Lage upper.

    Also ammunition can be a source of trouble. I mostly use Remington Golden but other brands have worked as well. Truncated cone bullets are a waste of time.
    Last edited by skoda; 11-18-2021 at 10:44 AM.

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    All Ruger 10/22 mags have or at least are supposed to have an ejector as an extended edge of one mag lip. I used to be able to say "the left lip", but I guess Ruger now makes a left hand version of the 10/22 with unique mags with the extended lip on the right side. The ejector that is mounted in the receiver of 10/22 is there to provide ejection when the mag has been removed.

    To get reliable feeding of truncated .22LR ammo, one often must "throat" the lower lip of the chamber and perhaps lightly "radius" the rest of the chamber lip.

    A number of .22LR firearm configurations often need either some sort of "booster" or the use of "high power" ammo to function reliably. Other known examples include some if not many AR-15/M16 4.5 in. barrel applications; AR-7 rifles and related firearms such as the Charter Arms Explorer II pistol and the IntraTec .22 Scorpion/Tec-22/Sport 22 pistols; and the POF Rebel pistol.

    Best of luck.

    MHO, YMMV, etc. Be well.

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    For what it is worth, my kit can hand cycle snap caps with just slightly modified BX-25s. Just needed to add a small amount of clearance for the feeding tab on the bolt. I marked up the followers with a sharpie then started filing, dremeling and stoning off the shiny spots until they cleared. if you hold a mag up against the bolt while it is removed, it becomes pretty obvious what is happening as the bolt gets forced toward the right side of the receiver as it contacts the mag.
    Lee

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    Hey Skoda;
    What was the better extractor that you used?

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    Here are the steps you need to follow.

    1. Polish the bolt, some of the bolts are parked and don't cycle smoothly in the parked upper.
    2. Use quality high velocity ammo. CCI Minimages used to be the standard.
    3. Somewhere on this board there are drawings of an improved extractor. Get one made or make one.
    4. Practical Innovations makes a 10/22 mage where you can adjust the mag depth and the feed angle, it can be helpful.
    5. Use a suppressor or a "booster" to increase back pressure.
    6. Insure the recoil road is perfectly lined up and is not binding the bolt.
    7. Throw that mess in the garbage and find a used Lage kit.

    Ok, that last one was a joke. Truthfully the quality control on those kits was garbage. It makes it infuriating as one person can have great luck with while five others have none. I was probably one of the last people to buy one of those new in around 2007 (mine was for the M11). I messed with it for years and can only recall one shooting outing where it ran acceptably. Go ahead and mess with it. Use my tips as well as the others here. Maybe you will be one of the lucky ones.
    My gun collection is one murderous rampage away from becoming an arsenal

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    Quote Originally Posted by prescottkid View Post
    Hey Skoda;
    What was the better extractor that you used?
    I got them from a guy named Chris Land. They and his contact were mentioned in a thread here called "Fleming 22 extractor?" from 2011. You can try to contact him (no idea if this is valid or if he still makes them): glockboy40@hotmail.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roaster72 View Post
    Here are the steps you need to follow.

    1. Polish the bolt, some of the bolts are parked and don't cycle smoothly in the parked upper.
    2. Use quality high velocity ammo. CCI Minimages used to be the standard.
    3. Somewhere on this board there are drawings of an improved extractor. Get one made or make one.
    4. Practical Innovations makes a 10/22 mage where you can adjust the mag depth and the feed angle, it can be helpful.
    5. Use a suppressor or a "booster" to increase back pressure.
    6. Insure the recoil road is perfectly lined up and is not binding the bolt.
    7. Throw that mess in the garbage and find a used Lage kit.

    Ok, that last one was a joke. Truthfully the quality control on those kits was garbage. It makes it infuriating as one person can have great luck with while five others have none. I was probably one of the last people to buy one of those new in around 2007 (mine was for the M11). I messed with it for years and can only recall one shooting outing where it ran acceptably. Go ahead and mess with it. Use my tips as well as the others here. Maybe you will be one of the lucky ones.
    thanks for those tips. the bolt seems to slide pretty well. i did experiment with ramline mags (have two of them) as well as the adjustable PI mag. brass seems to get tossed into the lower receiver or not cleanly stripped out. i did email chris land who was mentioned in this thread. hard to really test well since my lower is still in nfa jail and i’m restricted to shooting in an indoor range far away from all of my tools.

    the recoil rod is suspect since it seems to rub against the spring if it’s barely moved off center. i might need to replace that. can i use any recoil rod from standard m11/9s? this thing is such a tease. i wish lage was still making the .22 kits.

    i’ve also tried shooting this with a can. not a .22 can so backpressure isn’t as good as i’d like but i do have a deadair mask in nfa jail, but unfortunately at a different dealer.

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    taged

    I've got one.
    Not much luck yet.....tried lube...nope.
    Tried many mags...nope

    I need to dig it out and spend some quality time with it......It did one string of 10-15 rounds.

    10 round ruger mags were a no go and a pita to remove...why..idk
    BX 25...no luck
    It was some older mag that had the one run wunder.

    They are simple stupid with not much that moves......most rounds were hanging up on entry to bbl.
    It was bone dry when I got it and the one time it worked was dry..all parts are parked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by theduke View Post
    taged

    I've got one.
    Not much luck yet.....tried lube...nope.
    Tried many mags...nope

    I need to dig it out and spend some quality time with it......It did one string of 10-15 rounds.

    10 round ruger mags were a no go and a pita to remove...why..idk
    BX 25...no luck
    It was some older mag that had the one run wunder.

    They are simple stupid with not much that moves......most rounds were hanging up on entry to bbl.
    It was bone dry when I got it and the one time it worked was dry..all parts are parked.
    A Ramline 10/22 mag is what I have seen recommended the most.

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    Quote Originally Posted by yticllik View Post
    thanks for those tips. the bolt seems to slide pretty well. i did experiment with ramline mags (have two of them) as well as the adjustable PI mag. brass seems to get tossed into the lower receiver or not cleanly stripped out. i did email chris land who was mentioned in this thread. hard to really test well since my lower is still in nfa jail and i’m restricted to shooting in an indoor range far away from all of my tools.

    the recoil rod is suspect since it seems to rub against the spring if it’s barely moved off center. i might need to replace that. can i use any recoil rod from standard m11/9s? this thing is such a tease. i wish lage was still making the .22 kits.

    i’ve also tried shooting this with a can. not a .22 can so backpressure isn’t as good as i’d like but i do have a deadair mask in nfa jail, but unfortunately at a different dealer.
    I believe that my bolt had a removable black anodized aluminum piece that fit into the bolt. That piece served to direct the empties out if they didn't eject positively.

    The recoil rod was one of my biggest problems. The backplate it too small allowing the rod to become askew and then binding the bolt. IIRC mine also would fall down behind the stock lug. I solved that by filling the space behind the lug with a cut off piece of a buffer. It would be a small matter to cut off the backplate and weld on a plate that filled the entire rear of the upper and thus held it's position. I'm too lazy to do that as I have way too many projects and my Uzi 22 conversion works perfectly.
    My gun collection is one murderous rampage away from becoming an arsenal

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    each one is unique and has its own set of problems. That's why I stopped messing with them. Some needed the magwell cut off and aligned. Biggest improvement was making or getting on of Chris Lands extractors, fitting the bolt and tuning the recoil spring. adding a 60dg angle to the bolt helped too as it punted out the empties. Think I have a drawing for the improved extractor somewhere.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chili17 View Post
    each one is unique and has its own set of problems. That's why I stopped messing with them. Some needed the magwell cut off and aligned. Biggest improvement was making or getting on of Chris Lands extractors, fitting the bolt and tuning the recoil spring. adding a 60dg angle to the bolt helped too as it punted out the empties. Think I have a drawing for the improved extractor somewhere.
    If someone can provide a drawing or physical sample, I have an EDM and could make some extractors. Also, does anyone know what spring is correct for the M11/9 kits? I have found a source for very similar springs, but can't seem to find a firearm spring that is correct and can just be purchased. Thanks.
    Lee

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    I recall that he just sharpened up the part of the extractor that grabs the case. It's a small change. Ruger makes 50 billion of them a week, Mr. Land made a few so he could make things less production friendly but better for function. Just sketch one up, EDM it and give it a try. Then tweak until you get something good, make 200, and sell them here.

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    This is the extractor in my kit. What should be different in the “upgraded” ones?
    Lee
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    Here is my original Fleming extractor and a Chris Land extractor. I don't know if Fleming made his own or just used Ruger made parts.

    Screw it, here's the pic if you want to see it: https://imgur.com/jfmL7Ei

    I can't get anything to load tonight.......
    Last edited by skoda; 11-17-2021 at 11:54 PM.

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    A few things that made two kits run. The first thing is to make absolutely sure when installing the bolt into the upper that the recoil rod is not put in at even a slight angle. Keep it as in-line as possible and keep it lubed.
    I never was able to get any mags except Ramline mags to work. The owners manual said that the kits were made to use Ramlines. I spent a couple of years trying to rework other mags but with only limited success. When the kits first came out Ramline 25 and 30 rd mags were very plentiful and cheap.
    Chris Lands extractors helped, but mine also ran with the stock extractors. I did swap out to Chris Land extractors because they were better made.
    The units were made to run with CCI Mini Mags. Start with those and get the kit running before changing ammo brands.
    22lr has limited energy so you are trying harvest every bit of it to make these kits run. If ANYTHING needlessly robs the system of energy it has to be modified. Lube is your friend.

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    Mine was for the m10 only liked the steel lips mags with cci mini mag ammo. I tried many other combos that didn't seem to work.
    Def in one ear ecated in the other

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    I have two, and they both work reasonably well with no modifications. Occasionally they jam if I'm not careful when I take my finger off the trigger after a burst (need to "jab" at the trigger when firing). They do both have a "booster" on the end.

    This is from the first time I tried it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31RIcLkCcr0

    Now hosting: www.MAC-11.info

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