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Thread: The New "swapping uppers" ATF Letter

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by LawBob View Post
    Next Lage upper?
    YES!!! With water cooled rotating barrels 'Gatling Style'. That would be so cool. 6000 Rounds Per Minute!!!!!

    But then someone would come up with some springs and tungsten parts to slow it down to 3000 RPM.

  2. #42
    Registered User LawBob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skoda View Post
    YES!!! With water cooled rotating barrels 'Gatling Style'. That would be so cool. 6000 Rounds Per Minute!!!!!

    But then someone would come up with some springs and tungsten parts to slow it down to 3000 RPM.
    Then convert it to a pistol but make a bullpup

  3. #43
    Registered User DistalRadius's Avatar
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    Oh, FFS.


  4. #44
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    I bought two JAWS Commando Avengers as stripped receivers and it lists this in the ATF form as receiver only. If the receiver is the machine gun why do they need anymore information?

  5. #45
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    Because when the original form was created, the vast majority of machinegun receivers had a barrel attached and the stock was a fixed length.

    Scott

  6. #46
    Registered User Deerhurst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A&S Conversions View Post
    Because when the original form was created, the vast majority of machinegun receivers had a barrel attached and the stock was a fixed length.

    Scott
    So, that makes retroactive "legislation" ok?

    We will just ignore the fact that Congress makes laws and not aft. They are just FLEAs.

  7. #47
    Registered User LawBob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deerhurst View Post
    So, that makes retroactive "legislation" ok?

    We will just ignore the fact that Congress makes laws and not aft. They are just FLEAs.
    The secretary was given the authority to promulgate rules…. Blah blah blah

    I agree but let’s be thankful the law is $200 tax stamp and “trusts” are valid entities for ownership to circumvent the law signature requirement (since changed by 41p)

    The next time we have the opportunity we should not try to remove suppressors from the nfa

    Just change the rules - allow the sot02/07 to call in for permission and stick a $200 stamp on the form 4, out the door.

  8. #48
    Registered User Deerhurst's Avatar
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    Last I saw "rules" are not "laws".

  9. #49
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    And I thought that a Machine gun can be any overall length, can have any length barrel, and any kind of stock.

  10. #50
    Registered User LawBob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deerhurst View Post
    Last I saw "rules" are not "laws".
    They have the force of law if the law passed delegates it to the agency. Now if an agency interprets the law a certain way per the CFR, that’s not the law.

    A court decision isn’t a law either. Is Heller “the law?”

  11. #51
    Registered User LawBob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boomer535 View Post
    And I thought that a Machine gun can be any overall length, can have any length barrel, and any kind of stock.
    They can. The form 4 just seeks to properly identify the registered weapon.

  12. #52
    Registered User Deerhurst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LawBob View Post
    They have the force of law if the law passed delegates it to the agency. Now if an agency interprets the law a certain way per the CFR, that’s not the law.

    A court decision isn’t a law either. Is Heller “the law?”
    Correct. That we agree upon. An agency cannot just make up something and call it a law.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjsoccer3 View Post
    You got a permit for that freedom son?
    Exactly

  14. #54
    Registered User Shattered's Avatar
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    The ATF would LIKE you to notify them of changes…such as barrel length, caliber or completing a title 2 bare receiver by filling in the missing info in an addendum letter. It’s NOT required. You only get a letter back thanking you for helping to keep the NFTR updated. A nice warm fuzzy feeling. You can accomplish the same thing by pissing yourself in bed.

  15. #55
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    I would like to pick "THINGS I WILL NEVER EVER DO IN THIS LIFETIME", for $1000 Trebek.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shattered View Post
    The ATF would LIKE you to notify them of changes…such as barrel length, caliber or completing a title 2 bare receiver by filling in the missing info in an addendum letter. It’s NOT required. You only get a letter back thanking you for helping to keep the NFTR updated. A nice warm fuzzy feeling. You can accomplish the same thing by pissing yourself in bed.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by skoda View Post
    Maybe they just want to be able to identify it when one is found after a theft/crime/etc..
    I don't think they have that level of integrity.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnFreeman View Post
    I don't think they have that level of integrity.
    We also absolutely know high crimes treasonous chicom joe b. is china's death to America by a thousand cuts.

    Look at corrupt senile's deeds and totally insane ramblings...

    God Bless America During Our Darkest Years Of This Evil Attack.
    Last edited by Galil#1; 06-18-2022 at 05:42 AM.

  19. #59
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    So is the general consensus that this is a request and not a legal requirement? Not trying to dredge out whether the ATF should be able to make requirements but questioning whether they consider it one.
    Check out my Youtube channel

  20. #60
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    My understanding from my dealer is that they want to keep their records (data base?) as accurate as possible knowing that it is a mess. That way when they find a firearm they can more easily track it down and either return it to the owner (yah right) or prosecute them depending on the situation. If you put on a Lage 5.56 upper then the firearm will be very different from what their records say. Remember that many of their people are far from firearm experts. But think about it, really they will go by the manufacturer and serial number for the most part. Configuration is a secondary factor.

    I was told by an examiner about ten years ago that they want to know every time you change it's configuration (like change it's overall length by swapping the butt stock) or move the firearm's 'residence' within the state. But you are not required to do that, you are only required to inform them when you take it out of state for a temporary or permanent move. Seems like a lot of work on the owner's part to keep someone else's records straight. But you are an adult and you make your own choices.

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