A.R.C Weapons System??

[CrystalPepzi]

Looking at some old gun ads online and this one just really caught my eye. These are the only pictures I could find of it, the site I got them from was pretty brief about info regarding them too.

I'm surprised these things didn't go further, I would've bought one if they were still around. ARs were relatively common at that time, and it seems liked it was just a matter of swapping the upper like any other modern 9mm/.45 carbine kit. The side feeding might not be the most ideal, but hey, it looks cool

Anybody have any more info on these? Maybe even seen one/handled one? Was there anything particularly wrong with them?

 

[pjm204]

Looks pretty awesome to me. I'd definitely buy one if they still existed. I was going to say it wouldn't be a huge project to make one but the custom bolt to make it side feed kind of kills that. Though maybe you could turn a normal bolt on it's side and have it eject out the magwell?

 

[CrystalPepzi]

Looks pretty awesome to me. I'd definitely buy one if they still existed. I was going to say it wouldn't be a huge project to make one but the custom bolt to make it side feed kind of kills that. Though maybe you could turn a normal bolt on it's side and have it eject out the magwell?

That's what I was thinking, I guess you could modify some existing bolt to make it side feed. I gave this thing some thought and I just couldn't help thinking that the bolt and overall upper appearance looks a lot like a MAC upper. Maybe there's a way to make a MAC upper fit on a AR lower? I know it sounds stupid but I feel like if you can make the right adapter you can fit it all together somehow.

Turning the bolt on its side is a good idea, and just have it eject out of the bottom, though you'd have to cut out clearance for the hammer on the lower. I have a Cobray M11/9 but no AR to see if they can maybe merge somehow. I feel like the Cobray would be a bit too long, but maybe a RPB or MPA can fit better. They won't be side fed but maybe the MAC magwell can just go through the AR magwell and it will still eject from the side(?)

There looks to be some kind of end cap for the upper shown above, so that square receiver can fit nicely on the lower

This might just be my next big project haha

 

[b_saan]

I'm more interested in Ralph Walker's All-Purpose 12-gauge. I mean it's a 12 gauge for ALL PURPOSES, just think of the possibilities! :lol

 

[pjm204]

That's what I was thinking, I guess you could modify some existing bolt to make it side feed. I gave this thing some thought and I just couldn't help thinking that the bolt and overall upper appearance looks a lot like a MAC upper. Maybe there's a way to make a MAC upper fit on a AR lower? I know it sounds stupid but I feel like if you can make the right adapter you can fit it all together somehow.

Turning the bolt on its side is a good idea, and just have it eject out of the bottom, though you'd have to cut out clearance for the hammer on the lower. I have a Cobray M11/9 but no AR to see if they can maybe merge somehow. I feel like the Cobray would be a bit too long, but maybe a RPB or MPA can fit better. They won't be side fed but maybe the MAC magwell can just go through the AR magwell and it will still eject from the side(?)

There looks to be some kind of end cap for the upper shown above, so that square receiver can fit nicely on the lower

This might just be my next big project haha

I'll bust out my MPA-930 (mini mac) and MPA-30 to see how they look on an AR lower.

 

[CrystalPepzi]

I'll bust out my MPA-930 (mini mac) and MPA-30 to see how they look on an AR lower.

Thanks, let me know how it looks!

 

[strobro32]

It might be a cool idea for a 9/45/22 upper on a M11A1 SMG.

 

[DistalRadius]

Likle Flymans Calico project?

 

[pjm204]

It looks totally doable to me! I can't seem to get these images to embed.

 

[CrystalPepzi]

Likle Flymans Calico project?

Wow, now THAT is quite a project, so I guess it is possible to put a MAC upper on a AR lower. Didn't even know it was posted on UziTalk either, search bar doesn't pull up anything for me if I look it up. Seems like he did a lot of work to get that upper on with the mags he was using. Love the Calico mags and guns in general, but it seems like the sticks would be easier to work around.

Sad the videos don't work, I'd love to see it in action.

 

[CrystalPepzi]

It looks totally doable to me! I can't seem to get these images to embed.

Thanks for the pics pj, the upper in the second pic you posted looks like it can certainly fit with minimal work. Can the AR takedown pins fit through the takedown pin hole for the MAC? Or would it not fit/be too loose?

 

[usamark]

Looking at some old gun ads online and this one just really caught my eye. These are the only pictures I could find of it, the site I got them from was pretty brief about info regarding them too.

I'm surprised these things didn't go further, I would've bought one if they were still around. ARs were relatively common at that time, and it seems liked it was just a matter of swapping the upper like any other modern 9mm/.45 carbine kit. The side feeding might not be the most ideal, but hey, it looks cool

Anybody have any more info on these? Maybe even seen one/handled one? Was there anything particularly wrong with them?

In answer to your 'postulation' about there being anything wrong with these....
- Sights were crap, but that didn't matter because they were blocked by the cocking knob....the guy in the pic is wearing one x-ray vision contact (in the closed eye) so it was OK for him.
- No provision for any other sights.
- The little pin in the rear cap has to be removed with hammer and punch to open it up. I never opened it because it looked like the recoil spring and some other thing would fly out.
- The rear cap just has an angle on it, so it dents the lower hoop. No one would make this thing like that today, but this was 1984 (where's Wonder Woman!??)
- The Thompson mags had a small steel tab welded for the mag catch, so standard mags couldn't be used without that modification.
- Constructed of the heaviest steel available at the time.
- All the recoil went thru the front take down pin (after the AR recoil hoop was dented enough to avoid any further contact)
- The barrel was threaded 7/8-9 (std M10 threads) which suck.

On the good side, it seemed to work. Couldn't hit anything, tho.

My thought at the time was to make this a double barrel thing with a mag out each side and both eject out the top. Call it a 'bowgun' and make a wookie puking noise whenever you shoot it. Waa-aa-aa-aa PEW! Go space munkee, Go!

 

[pjm204]

Thanks for the pics pj, the upper in the second pic you posted looks like it can certainly fit with minimal work. Can the AR takedown pins fit through the takedown pin hole for the MAC? Or would it not fit/be too loose?

I didn't try putting the AR takedown pin through since they definitely won't line up anyway. No feed ramp which is an issue. Also the bolt can't be turned on its side since the barrel is not centered in the receiver vertically. Could be a fun project though. I like the look with the full size MPA upper.

 

[CrystalPepzi]

In answer to your 'postulation' about there being anything wrong with these....
- Sights were crap, but that didn't matter because they were blocked by the cocking knob....the guy in the pic is wearing one x-ray vision contact (in the closed eye) so it was OK for him.
- No provision for any other sights.
- The little pin in the rear cap has to be removed with hammer and punch to open it up. I never opened it because it looked like the recoil spring and some other thing would fly out.
- The rear cap just has an angle on it, so it dents the lower hoop. No one would make this thing like that today, but this was 1984 (where's Wonder Woman!??)
- The Thompson mags had a small steel tab welded for the mag catch, so standard mags couldn't be used without that modification.
- Constructed of the heaviest steel available at the time.
- All the recoil went thru the front take down pin (after the AR recoil hoop was dented enough to avoid any further contact)
- The barrel was threaded 7/8-9 (std M10 threads) which suck.

On the good side, it seemed to work. Couldn't hit anything, tho.

My thought at the time was to make this a double barrel thing with a mag out each side and both eject out the top. Call it a 'bowgun' and make a wookie puking noise whenever you shoot it. Waa-aa-aa-aa PEW! Go space munkee, Go!

I can see issues with the weight and disassembly, I would imagine the thing would be extremely heavy since it has to rely on the mass of the bolt and all that weight is so far forward. I didn't think the sights looked too bad, then again I've never seen one of these in person lol. Sucks about the mags and take down pin though.

Have you handled one of these and shot them before? It looks like you're speaking from personal experience, judging by your wording.

 

[CrystalPepzi]

I didn't try putting the AR takedown pin through since they definitely won't line up anyway. No feed ramp which is an issue. Also the bolt can't be turned on its side since the barrel is not centered in the receiver vertically. Could be a fun project though. I like the look with the full size MPA upper.

Fair enough

I guess the only way to do it then is to have the mag go through the AR magwell, though it might not be able to to clear it since the MAC magazine is slightly wider than the AR magwell, atleast judging from the 10 round Zytels I have. Maybe it can work with Sten mag converted MACs? or .380 variants? It does seem like a fun project, if I had the time and money to do it I totally would.

Maybe I'll have to save the idea for the future.

 

[pjm204]

Fair enough

I guess the only way to do it then is to have the mag go through the AR magwell, though it might not be able to to clear it since the MAC magazine is slightly wider than the AR magwell, atleast judging from the 10 round Zytels I have. Maybe it can work with Sten mag converted MACs? or .380 variants? It does seem like a fun project, if I had the time and money to do it I totally would.

Maybe I'll have to save the idea for the future.

The mag in the picture on that magazine cover either looks like a grease gun or sten mag which seems more likely than modified thompson. I tried it with a sten mag in the AR magwell and it fits, they also make sten magwell adapters. I didn't try a zytel since I'd rather use sten anyway. They do also make Glock magwell adapters but they're pretty expensive. Lastly the Endomag could work.

 

[sniperdoc]

I presume that in 84, AR Pistols were nonexistent (earliest I remember is the OA93), so you would had to either go SBR or use it on an M16, right?

 

[usamark]

@crystalpepsi - Yes. Ran the ARC upper on a post M16 back in 2007. sniperdoc made a good observation...back in the day ('84), it probably didn't make any sense...there were no 'AR pistols' and SBR's were rare because you could make a transferable MG, but the ARC upper didn't support full auto. I remember thinking "Why did they make this?" while shooting it. At the time, we were running the Olympic 45, 10mm and 9mm uppers, which made more sense (ran full auto, had usable sights and could use the stock. You can't get down low enough on that ARC upper to see thru the sights even if the cocking knob wasn't in the way.

 

[CrystalPepzi]

Good point, I guess AR pistols haven't really been as big like they are today, and since they weren't FA capable there would be quite a limited number of people that would want one. I'd much prefer the Olympic lol, sounds like the ARC wasn't too much of a joy to shoot. Would be a decent idea now for the semi auto market, with either a short or 16 inch barrel (minus the fact the sights sucked and overall design was meh) but now I realize why they didn't have much success at all.


Still though, I can't help thinking how cool it would be to have a MAC upper on a AR lower most likely cheaper than a dedicated AR 9mm upper. And since pj said the sten mags fit in the AR there's a good possibility you can retrofit a MAC onto the lower. Just a thought lol.

 

[Loco]

Sub Tek. 45 upper. Ejects out of mag well. Runs quite well, and BCG uses parts from standard AR. A few pieces would require fitment/ machining, but can be made from AR parts.

I purchased one when the guy who made them was still in biz. It was a special cerakote version he'd made for a friend, who later decided to go 9mm.

I enjoy quirky stuff that works...

The ultimate in redundancy would be strapping this to a Mac 10 with the AR upper adaptor.