Another 7.62x39 mag question

[Sidewinder]

Know it this was discussed earlier, but is it still agreed that the C Products 30 round mag in 7.62x39 is not worth buying?

If that's the skinny and not including the Franken mags, what's the best 7.62x39 mag, if indeed there is one? Or is one better off using .223 mags loaded with five rounds or so?

 

[gunbunny]

I pulled my 7.62x39 barrel out of my upper and plan on using it as a club.

 

[Sidewinder]

mag disgust?

So gunbunny, I take it you went the club route out of disgust with the mag situation regarding reliable mags? I can't understand why no manufacturer can seem to make a functioning 7.62x39 mag for the AR.

I guess I could always use another club.

 

[amphibian]

I'll take those clubs if you don't want them!!

 

[gunbunny]

Yep, I'm a disgrunteled magazine owner. I've had this barrel and bolt for five years now with no joy. The best I've been able to get 6-7 rounds semi through an Alexander Arms .50 Beowulf magazine. My barrel has less than 250 rounds through it, you get tired of shooting single shot very quickly.

 

[hotbrass]

I got four and was promised they would send me ones that work and never did. The problem I have is the follower binds all the time. I can get three, four, five round bursts and occaisionally a few more. But I have had only two or three magazine dumps.

And almost every time I shoot semi auto, the second shot is not presented or chambered. And it gets worse from there. Pull the mag and slap it on whatever is convenient to get the follower loose and another round at the top.

Every country in the world can make AR mags but nobody can make a AK mag. I have been told that there will be more 7.62 mags available from other manufacturers. Some were announced after the SHOT show this year. I dont know but I heard MAGPUL is one of them.

I have better luck using a plano 223 mag and load 15 round of 7.63x39. And the 10 rd DPMS mags work great!

 

[A&S Conversions]

I'll buy your club if you are looking to sell. Mag issues aside there are a couple issues with a 7.62X39 upper that I have noticed. First, since 7.62X39 has a larger diameter but the top of the magazine is the same height, that puts the center of the round a little lower compared to 5.56X45. So having extended feed ramps really helps.

Second, again the feed ramps in an AR barrel extension, are designed for the narrower 5.56 round. I've noticed that the sharp top of the feed ramps will cut small grooves in the bullet and shell of the 7.62 round as it feeds into the barrel. I've used a Dremel tool to extend and round the top of the feed ramps. For me, this has really helped feeding the larger diameter 7.62 rounds into the AR barrel.

I first noticed the grooves in my first Colt 7.62X39 upper when I had a Colt RR. I fed the upper using "Franken" mags. I also have an AK drum with an AR feed tower. At first my upper didn't run very well. It would run but not consistently. It seemed when I had a stoppage, the round had started toward or into the barrel, but didn't feed completely into the chamber. I noticed two diverging lines scraped into the round. Even on the fired cases I noticed the grooves. After I extended the feed ramps, rounded the top of the feed ramp grooves, and polished the feed ramps my 7.62X39 uppers ran much better.

In my opinion, it isn't just the mag that is the issue. While the mag is important, I found the size and shape of the feed ramp to be as important. This is a complete system. I have Colt, Blackthorne and DPMS 7.62X39 AR barrels. All of them have shallow and sharp feed ramps. The Colt barrels did have M4 feed ramps which was a good start. I smoothed them up and that really seemed to help.

Take your 7.62X39 upper to the range and try it again. Look to see if there are marks on the jammed and even the fired cases. Like "amphibian", 7.62X39 is my favorite AR round. It has a little more punch but is still controllable. With 220 grain EBR subsonic and my AAC M47-2000 can, I have an AR/M16 that I can shoot a rifle round and not need hearing protection. I wish you luck. If you wish to give up on that round, please let me know. I'd be willing to buy it.

Scott

 

[MGI]

Please keep in mind that I might be a bit biased since we make an AK mag well. That being said.... There is a magazine that works very very well with the 7.62x39 round. The Soviets designed their mag for that round, it has been around for many years, and it is combat proven.

The AK round is tapered, and as such, creates a curve when you stack a bunch of them together. Attempting to break this fact of geometry and fit a curve through a much straighter mag well which was never designed for it, is destined to fail, (eventually) even if it occationally works with small samples of rounds. This is just my opinion though. At the risk of sounding like a sale pitch I would suggest to anyone interested in shooting 7.62x 39 to at least look at our AK mag wells on the AR platform.

As an aside, please keep in mind that the so-called colt 7.62 upper, is actually an AR-15 upper receiver mated with a 7.62 barrel. The AR 15 upper receiver was never designed with the intent of accommadating the wider AK mags. Although we have resolved this issue, it does lend itself to an interesting topic for conversation.

Mack.

 

[amphibian]

There have been many threads where I've raved about the MGI setup. It is pretty all I use now. The mag catch design for the AK mags is also superior. With the AR-47 lower, sometimes the drum would fall out. With the MGI mag catch design that is not possible.

Just wish you guys would come out w/ that AK-74 mag well.

Mack, I sent you an email, please respond to my questions on the email...via email since they are dealer related.
Thanks

 

[hotbrass]

Please keep in mind that I might be a bit biased since we make an AK mag well.

Mack.

So how much are your AK mag wells? I will just guess that we have to buy the rest of the lower from you also, and how much is that? Thanks!

 

[amphibian]

So how much are your AK mag wells? I will just guess that we have to buy the rest of the lower from you also, and how much is that? Thanks!

It's all on their website, check it out: http://www.mgimilitary.com/store/index.php?main_page=products_all&zenid=b6324657d5e0455be385b0382afd7096

They have the following options: complete rifle (AR or AK), complete lower (AR or AK), stripped lower (AR or AK or w/ M3 GreaseGun magwell)

Here is a link to an old thread about the MGI lower: http://www.uzitalk.net/forums/showthread.php?t=26728

 

[cvasqu03]

Just curious, has anyone tried the Olympic AR 30rd mags in 7.62x39? They're not frankenmags, they are distinctively AR looking, but they have the same curve as the AK mags. I actually thought they looked a little strange. MidwayUSA carries them. Kind of pricey even with dealer discount, but if it's really that hard to get mags that work, it might be worth it to someone (if they actually work of course).

Here's the link. They were in stock as of the moment I posted this.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=187547&t=11082005

 

[amphibian]

Just curious, has anyone tried the Olympic AR 30rd mags in 7.62x39? They're not frankenmags, they are distinctively AR looking, but they have the same curve as the AK mags. I actually thought they looked a little strange. MidwayUSA carries them. Kind of pricey even with dealer discount, but if it's really that hard to get mags that work, it might be worth it to someone (if they actually work of course).

Here's the link. They were in stock as of the moment I posted this.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=187547&t=11082005

Those are most likely C-Products made for Olympic.
http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38662

 

[cvasqu03]

Those are most likely C-Products made for Olympic.
http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38662

All the C-Products AR 7.62x39 mags I've seen have the same curve as the 223 mags, the Olympic ones seem to have an AK like curve to them. Of course all I've ever seen are pictures. You've seen them so do the C-products mags actually look like the new Olympic mags? If so that would be a good sign that they're just re-branded.

 

[hotbrass]

Here is a 30 rnd C Products 7.62x39 mag next to a .223 30 round mag. Huge difference in radius. Still a POS.

 

[cvasqu03]

Here is a 30 rnd C Products 7.62x39 mag next to a .223 30 round mag. Huge difference in radius. Still a POS.

Thanks, those are just like the Olympic ones I saw. It looks like Midway has the wrong picture on the c-products ones. I guess they really are rebranded for Olympic. This is very dissapointing as I was hoping to get an AR in this caliber but at this rate I'll have to sacrifice some of my AK mags to make frankenmags.

Maybe I'll just go with the MGI setup.

 

[hotbrass]

The pic on midway is the first attempt by C Products to make a 7.62x39 mag, which was worse than the POS they have now.

 

[amphibian]

The thread I referenced above was regarding the latest C-Products attempt to do a 7.62x39 mag which is the one with big curve.
As mentioned in the thread, friend of mine has two of them. He had to tweak the feed lips on one of them and I was able to shoot it in full auto in my gun with no malfunctions. The second one he didn't want to alter and it wouldn't work in my gun or his.
So I guess if you're desperate you can tinker w/ the C-Products if you don't want to spend the money on an AR-47 or MGI.

 

[cvasqu03]

The thread I referenced above was regarding the latest C-Products attempt to do a 7.62x39 mag which is the one with big curve.
As mentioned in the thread, friend of mine has two of them. He had to tweak the feed lips on one of them and I was able to shoot it in full auto in my gun with no malfunctions. The second one he didn't want to alter and it wouldn't work in my gun or his.
So I guess if you're desperate you can tinker w/ the C-Products if you don't want to spend the money on an AR-47 or MGI.

Yeah, doesn't seem worth it to buy brand new mags that you have to dremel and mill down before they work halfway decent. Especially at that price. I can't believe after all this time nobody has been able to come up with a working mag that doesn't look like it was put together by a guy named bubba in his backyard.

 

[subgunner]

Yeah, doesn't seem worth it to buy brand new mags that you have to dremel and mill down before they work halfway decent. Especially at that price. I can't believe after all this time nobody has been able to come up with a working mag that doesn't look like it was put together by a guy named bubba in his backyard.

Yeah but my Bubba mags work FA!

Given the cost of an MGI lower with an AK magwell plus the added expense to machine the upper and carrier unless I had a DIAS or LL I'd just as soon buy another AK.

The AR47 lower is a better deal if all you want to do is use AK mags. It's about half the cost of the MGI but you can still get a cheap AK for the same money.