Range Report w/New Rifle - Good news, and just a little bad news, maybe

[CaptainPhil]

So, a LONG while ago I did a little horse trading with another member and ended up with a 'Galil Sporter' bu Century with a GAL serial number. Previous owner said had only put "a few rounds" through it but said it functioned fine. The rifle LOOKED fabulous and in good condition. Finish about 90% with a little handling wear and a slight wobble in the folder. Over all I was pleased with the fit and finish, but that was just my inexperienced eye reviewing my new purchase, and we all know how reliable THAT is!

Well, I finally got to get to the range yesterday and had a chance to dance with her a bit, and the best good news that I could get is that she feeds and functions very well. I got 4 different mags in the deal (2 Izzy and 2 ??) and with 20 rounds it each they fed brass cased ammo perfectly all day. I wanted to start with brass to make sure I gave her the best chance to work the first time out. Next time I will try some steel case and see what I get.

The only feeding issue that I encountered was only 2 - 3 times (out of 30 mag full shot) when a new mag is inserted and the action racked, the first round would hang up and get crushed when the bolt came forward. Remove mag, remove bent round, reinsert and rack, voila, she ate the rest with out complaint. I suspect poor mag loading by the 2 rookies I had doing the dirty work, but will recheck this next outing.

The bad news is that she shoots about 6 inches right at 30 yards. As my son was shooting I looked down and noticed that front sight hood/ghost ring looked twisted a bit. I examined it closer and it still seemed that way. Today is gun cleaning day and will look closer and see if I can get a picture for the brainiacs here to examine.

One more thing I discovered is after a hundred rounds she get FUCKING HOT. My son had a feed jam (as described above) and as he started to deal with it the muzzle cam flying around (MUZZLE DISCIPLINE DAMMIT!) so I grabbed it and heard the sizzle of my thumb BEFORE my brain screamed "THAT'S HOT! LET GO!"

So all in all I am VERY pleased. It works. I would like "those that keep the knowledge" to tell me a couple of things, and I have a couple of questions:

1 - I BELIEVE from what I have read here this is a Caspian made receiver, but would like someone to confirm or advise what I really have. I know about the 2 piece firing pin, but for the moment is not a concern in the slightest.

2 - Has anyone had this potential canted sight/sight block issue before? What is the solution, assuming it really is canted and not just out of adjustment?

 

[gbfirearmsales]

A canted gas block on the Galil is not easy....any significant canting would result in the gas tube not being aligned right which I'd think would result in the gas piston wanting to bind in the tube. It's not like the AK's, that the front sight is independent from the gas block.

Look at it muzzle end, is the block/sight to the left of 12 noon, or to the right of 12 noon?

If it is to the left, the barrel "may" be able to be tweaked / torqued a hair which will bring the block/sight in alignment. If it is actually canted past 12 o'clock...well...loosening the barrel to bring the block back "may" work, as long as the barrel remains properly torqued. (ez if you have a solid large vice and a good barrel wrench, or a high quality box wrench and torque wrench(careful not to round the edges)

Otherwise......Solutions are to remove the barrel and shim it (I don't like this at all) or

remove the gas block, close the gas port hole (tig it shut), realign the block/sight, press it into place, and redrill the pin detents, gas port all over again. (ez if you have a press and proper blocks to remove and re-press the gas block)

Is the front handguard mount properly aligned, or does that seem lightly canted along with the sight? If thats canted too, then perhaps the barrel is just a hair off its timing.

Also check for a bent barrel. I've heard of idiots trying to bend the barrels to help them shoot straight and shipping guns out like that.

Let us know what you find.

I looked down and noticed that front sight hood/ghost ring looked twisted a bit.
2 - Has anyone had this potential canted sight/sight block issue before? What is the solution, assuming it really is canted and not just out of adjustment?

 

[CaptainPhil]

ok, have a couple of pictures here: http://picasaweb.google.com/1009540...?authkey=Gv1sRgCKqy-PCywe-OBQ&feat=directlink

It appears that the top sight hood/ring is twisted on the horizontal axis to the left, but the gas block itself is square and fine. The sight is a little loose, meaning I can wiggle it a little if I force it. So I am thinking if I square it up and secure it the issue may go away.

Please ignore the dirty rifle in the pics. Like I said, today is cleaning day and she is MUCH prettier that she appears in the pics. LOL

 

[Che]

To me, it's hard to tell from the photos which way the FSB may be canted. Are you sure the gun was held straight up in both? (The first looks to the right and the 2nd to the left).

If the gas tube looks like it is not canted (holes on each side of the gas tubes are the same distance from top dead center,and the lower hand guard "looks" like it is straight, then I would think that the front sight base/gas block is canted, which will most likely needed someone like Tennigalil to fix.

Or, take a string and position it at the front center of the receiver (at the barrel end) and stretch it to the center of the flash hider, and see how far everything is off. You can also stretch the string from the center of the rear sight to the center of the flash hider.

Also, does the front sight post looks to be vertical, or leaning one way?


I know it's not what you wanted to hear---but to fix it right someone knowledgeable needs to work on it. Twisting the barrel to align it will affect head space, and you don't want to mess with that!

 

[CaptainPhil]

Yes, I agree that someone 'smarter than me' needs to have a look should it be a real thing, however . . .

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/pdIN7KIDWT5z-rediyAF2uyX0WV5isfVF_9eXEnk1yg?feat=directlink

This is a better picture and you can clearly see the sight is canted inside the block, so I am thinking a little work and another range trip to see.

The rifle shoots straight. Once I noticed the issue, hold left 6 inches and I get a nice, consistent group. If the barrel was bent, my understanding is it wouldn't group and be all over the place, yes?

Going to clean her up and break out a screwdriver and see if it will go back to square with out much fuss.

Gee . . . what IF I got one that was perfect except for a loose front sight that was out of adjustment? How COOL would that be?

 

[fingaz]

I know what the problem is you are describing. It is not, as many have thought, like an AK where the gas block is *rotated* out of perfect position around the barrel, but the front sight dovetail is worn or undersize, and because of that, the two opposing screws that hold and adjust the front sight force it to turn, on the horizontal plane as you said, in its dovetail.

A search of this forum would find my posting about the exact same issue with my wonderful Golani. A posting to which, IIRC, no one replied.

I first tried a new (used) front sight, and it fit the same way. I also realized it was missing the Z spring, bought one and it did not help. So we are left with a couple of ways to deal with this.

One is, if you have a selection of shim material, you could find the right thickness to fix under the front sight in the dovetail to force the fit to be tighter, squaring the hood to the rear sight. I did not do that. Besides, I was unsure doing it this way would force me to not use the Z spring.

My solution was to carefully place the front sight upside down in a padded vise and used a light ball pein hammer to tap the bottom of the sight's male dovetail at opposite corners and test fit it until it looked "right" and square in the gas block. You can find the proper corners to tap easily, as they are the short parts of the dovetail due to the round relief cut for the screw heads on each side.

If the above is not clear, I will take photos, but once you have the sight out of the gas block, I think you will see what I mean.

Like your rifle, mine shot great (and windage was even correct) even before I corrected the twist. But it also bothered me that looking through the front sight hood was not seeing a true circle, but a short length of tube turned just a bit to the side. Maddening. Now, it shoots like a laser beam, I only see a true circular ring around the front sight post, and I am happy (until I need to tap tap tap again). After all, if it got like this once before, how much use/abuse/etc. will it take to happen again?

Good luck!

 

[kargo27]

Well described, Fingaz. Mine is the same way.

 

[Tenngalil]

Replace the hood with a new one.
If it's still loose then the gas block needs replacement.
i've seen a few of these and it makes my eyes cross trying to sight in.

If the rifle runs with brass i'd say you're in good shape.

 

[fingaz]

I agree totally with TennGalil if it is really needed. In the case of my gun, it runs great with brass and steel case Wolf, whether FMJ or hollowpoint too. So while I might need a new sight hood, or even a new gas block, I am loathe to spend the $$ at this point when I have corrected the issue to satisfaction for the time being.

Now, if I choose to have my rifle modfied to a new look, say I want it converted to non-NFA SAR configuration, then other issues will be addressed at the same time.

It would be easier if parts were a little more available in new condition at reasonable prices. I am just glad these rifles, once working well, are pretty trouble free for any forseeable length of time and usage... zombie assault nightmares excluded!

 

[CaptainPhil]

Replace the hood with a new one.
If it's still loose then the gas block needs replacement.
i've seen a few of these and it makes my eyes cross trying to sight in.

If the rifle runs with brass i'd say you're in good shape.

Thank you Obi-Wan, I was really hoping you would chime in here.

I will start looking for the part (got one laying around anywhere?) but wanted to ask what the 'correct' dimension is for that dove tail? If I measure and it is obviously out of whack I can save myself the cost of a new hood.

Yes, I am a cheap bastard when I need to be, and 'The Accountant' is not likely to be favorable on "more gun shit." Need to save those moments for stuff I REALLY need LOL

Sad, but a lot of you know of what I speak.

Thanks to all of you for the help. I was sporting a semi when I FINALLY got to rack a round and dance with her. REALLY dig the rifle, and the (dented) brass landed 20 feet at the forward 45 degree angle, just as described.

 

[CaptainPhil]

ended up with a 'Galil Sporter' bu Century with a GAL serial number.

1 - I BELIEVE from what I have read here this is a Caspian made receiver, but would like someone to confirm or advise what I really have. I know about the 2 piece firing pin, but for the moment is not a concern in the slightest.

Any feedback on this part of it? Receiver is Caspian, or ORF?

Anything else about this version of the Galil Sporter (NOT Golani) that I now happily own?

Thanks to all the knowledgeable folks for the sharing of your knowledge. This is always the coolest part of a new firearm, learning it's history, and the 'story' behind it.

 

[adipose]

GAL serial number prefix = ORF receiver

 

[CaptainPhil]

Is the fact that is says "Galil Sporter" instead of Golani of any significance?

 

[Tenngalil]

Yep, it's one from before Century was sued by IWI for using the "Galil" name.
And it's probably a non-spring loaded firing pin version.
ORF rec.

 

[Bu2]

Is the fact that is says "Galil Sporter" instead of Golani of any significance?

No. It just means it was early in the production run.

 

[CaptainPhil]

Another question: Since I am buying a new front sight, is there any advantage to getting the larger R4 sight?