Super Safety Review
- Thread starter strobro32
- Start date
Alaska_Shooter
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2004
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- 433
I’ve heard that it does but there’s something different about it. Maybe it needs a modified lever or something. The problem with that gun is $$$$$$
I’ve shot my buddy’s postie FA quite a bit. Very fun
From FB along with a video showing it running:
Doable but not easy. The GEN12 carrier doesn’t have a proper full auto cut so we had to bolt a trip to the front of a MVB Industries buffer from their proprietary ARC stock system to get it to work with a Rare Breed FRT-15. That wouldn’t work with a Super Safety. You’d need to make a GEN12 specific lever to work with the non-standard cut on the carrier if you wanted to run a SS in it.
———
It's been done with a Gen12 using one of our V308 kits. Customer replaced the screw and used springs on both sides of the lever iirc from his write up in this group. You may be able to find it via searching for "Genesis , Gen12, Gen-12" etc . We were tasked with putting a kit together but never got past buying the right machine screws, that took over a month to be delivered and we moved on to other projects.
——-
I’ve shot my buddy’s postie FA quite a bit. Very fun
From FB along with a video showing it running:
Doable but not easy. The GEN12 carrier doesn’t have a proper full auto cut so we had to bolt a trip to the front of a MVB Industries buffer from their proprietary ARC stock system to get it to work with a Rare Breed FRT-15. That wouldn’t work with a Super Safety. You’d need to make a GEN12 specific lever to work with the non-standard cut on the carrier if you wanted to run a SS in it.
———
It's been done with a Gen12 using one of our V308 kits. Customer replaced the screw and used springs on both sides of the lever iirc from his write up in this group. You may be able to find it via searching for "Genesis , Gen12, Gen-12" etc . We were tasked with putting a kit together but never got past buying the right machine screws, that took over a month to be delivered and we moved on to other projects.
——-
Got the SS in the SP5 today.
1st go light primer strikes so light they were barley showing.
Swapped hammer and hammer spring.
2nd go it ran and fired all 5 rounds.
Moved up to 10 rnds and it won't cycle more then 5 rnds without jamming the average is 2-3 rounds before jamming.
It's eating the empties in any position you can think of.
It's a failure to eject issue.
The cases are gettting stuck in all kinds of weird positions between the bolt & receiver.
Also sometimes jammed right inside between the bolt and a chambered live round.
switched from my reloads ( 150 grn 3.2 bullseye) to federal 147 grn.
Same issue and that stuff is NOT subsonic.
The wife could here me from across the street, out in the field, while she was inside of the house, with the federal stuff going throught the octane so it's a lot hotter then my reloads. ( holy run on sentence batman! )
So it's not a ammo issue.
I've been shooting the same reloads since day one.
Today was the 1st day the gun saw a factory round.
Measured and started cutting the buffer no inprovement after a 1/2 inch off of it. even tried removing the buffer no change at all.
Noticed the buffer was just sliding back and forth on the recoil rod so I built up the end with the buffer using masking tape to keep it in place.
No improvment but the buffer stays at the rear now.
I'm going to go get a new piece of rubber tube tomorrow and try longer lengths to shorter and see if I can get anywhere that way.
I know nothing of the H&K roller system this is the only H&K product I own. I have read where the K version needs different rollers for a can to eject prolerly.
could it be that, the extractor, or maybe the ejector?
Gun has never had a malfuction in factory config.
Specs
H&K SP5 full size.
H&K factory mags ( tried two different ones)
Lee sporting lower.
Lee sporting buffef.
Mil spec AR LPK ( semi )
GMR SS
GMR trip
GMR cut trigger.
150 grn hard cast lead 3.2 grns bullseye.
Federal 147 factory ammo ( sux ass cause it's loud) 1st time ever trying factory 147
SWR Octane 9 can.
On a side note:
I feel bad you guys buying factory subsonic 147 9mm ammo.
Stuff is not subsonic and I can see why so many guntubers wear hearing protection when shooting factory loads.
Maybe it's just a federal thing.
No idea only bought it for testing this to rule out ammo that works in every other 9mm I've shot it through.
Won't be buying any more of it that's for sure.
1st go light primer strikes so light they were barley showing.
Swapped hammer and hammer spring.
2nd go it ran and fired all 5 rounds.
Moved up to 10 rnds and it won't cycle more then 5 rnds without jamming the average is 2-3 rounds before jamming.
It's eating the empties in any position you can think of.
It's a failure to eject issue.
The cases are gettting stuck in all kinds of weird positions between the bolt & receiver.
Also sometimes jammed right inside between the bolt and a chambered live round.
switched from my reloads ( 150 grn 3.2 bullseye) to federal 147 grn.
Same issue and that stuff is NOT subsonic.
The wife could here me from across the street, out in the field, while she was inside of the house, with the federal stuff going throught the octane so it's a lot hotter then my reloads. ( holy run on sentence batman! )
So it's not a ammo issue.
I've been shooting the same reloads since day one.
Today was the 1st day the gun saw a factory round.
Measured and started cutting the buffer no inprovement after a 1/2 inch off of it. even tried removing the buffer no change at all.
Noticed the buffer was just sliding back and forth on the recoil rod so I built up the end with the buffer using masking tape to keep it in place.
No improvment but the buffer stays at the rear now.
I'm going to go get a new piece of rubber tube tomorrow and try longer lengths to shorter and see if I can get anywhere that way.
I know nothing of the H&K roller system this is the only H&K product I own. I have read where the K version needs different rollers for a can to eject prolerly.
could it be that, the extractor, or maybe the ejector?
Gun has never had a malfuction in factory config.
Specs
H&K SP5 full size.
H&K factory mags ( tried two different ones)
Lee sporting lower.
Lee sporting buffef.
Mil spec AR LPK ( semi )
GMR SS
GMR trip
GMR cut trigger.
150 grn hard cast lead 3.2 grns bullseye.
Federal 147 factory ammo ( sux ass cause it's loud) 1st time ever trying factory 147
SWR Octane 9 can.
On a side note:
I feel bad you guys buying factory subsonic 147 9mm ammo.
Stuff is not subsonic and I can see why so many guntubers wear hearing protection when shooting factory loads.
Maybe it's just a federal thing.
No idea only bought it for testing this to rule out ammo that works in every other 9mm I've shot it through.
Won't be buying any more of it that's for sure.
Got it running today 100% put over 500 rnds through it of the hard cast 150 reloads and not a single failure.
My SP5 is now fully semi automatic.
Did some searching around this morning on the SS and SP5
Seems a dead or light strike is a over ground hammer.
No mention of what is over ground on it.
I have three that work fine in Colt guns and 2 more in LPK that all either were dead no primer strike or so light you could just see it.
Two out 6 hammers I have dropped in and fired.
I cut the buffer back 1/2 inch total and used masking tape to build up the recoil rod to hold it in place.
It was just sliding around back and forth and causing issues along with being a bit to long.
( Probably where the jamming on ejection was coming from )
Tried using the GMR ejector but it doesn't fit in the lower.
Well it does I had to open the pivot hole on the ejector with a reamer but then it was to short and cases were just getting shoved back into the chamber followed by a live round.
Once I found a hammer that worked, got the buffer stationary and the right lenght, it works fine now.
Ran a bunch of KCI 20 rnd mags a few KCI 30's and some H&K mags for a bit over 500 rounds trouble free.
Still neex to try the 40 rnd AC unity mags and the MagPull drums out but I'd call it fixed after a bit of reading and trouble shooting.
I still need to aquire a piece of silicone tubing that fits tight on the recoil rod for a buffer. Tape is pretty ghetto but works for proving the theroy you don't want the buffer just riding around in the receiver.
Now to buy a SP5K and do it again!
My SP5 is now fully semi automatic.
Did some searching around this morning on the SS and SP5
Seems a dead or light strike is a over ground hammer.
No mention of what is over ground on it.
I have three that work fine in Colt guns and 2 more in LPK that all either were dead no primer strike or so light you could just see it.
Two out 6 hammers I have dropped in and fired.
I cut the buffer back 1/2 inch total and used masking tape to build up the recoil rod to hold it in place.
It was just sliding around back and forth and causing issues along with being a bit to long.
( Probably where the jamming on ejection was coming from )
Tried using the GMR ejector but it doesn't fit in the lower.
Well it does I had to open the pivot hole on the ejector with a reamer but then it was to short and cases were just getting shoved back into the chamber followed by a live round.
Once I found a hammer that worked, got the buffer stationary and the right lenght, it works fine now.
Ran a bunch of KCI 20 rnd mags a few KCI 30's and some H&K mags for a bit over 500 rounds trouble free.
Still neex to try the 40 rnd AC unity mags and the MagPull drums out but I'd call it fixed after a bit of reading and trouble shooting.
I still need to aquire a piece of silicone tubing that fits tight on the recoil rod for a buffer. Tape is pretty ghetto but works for proving the theroy you don't want the buffer just riding around in the receiver.
Now to buy a SP5K and do it again!
No problem Strobro.
I'm going to guess the hammer was the problem.
As I went through a bunch of hammers.
When the 2nd hammer I found worked the whole gun worked.
So I'm guessing the original hammer I had firing yesterday was rubbing the ejector up front where it makes contact either to much or not enough.
Like I mentioned I don't know anything about the H&K stuff.
Best I can recommend is like anything one change at a time.
Ya it's a lot of tear down & reassembly but it's a easy gun to tear apart.
And the Lee lower is just as easy.
I made a vid but my phone is so potato it's not even bearable to watch.
Might try another vid tomorrow with the wife's phone hers is newer by a few years.
I'll post it if I do, now the not so fun part of cleaning the gun & can.
Here is to hoping for a 3 position AK and AUG SS.
I'm gonna buy more of these. I see that in my future for sure.
I'm going to guess the hammer was the problem.
As I went through a bunch of hammers.
When the 2nd hammer I found worked the whole gun worked.
So I'm guessing the original hammer I had firing yesterday was rubbing the ejector up front where it makes contact either to much or not enough.
Like I mentioned I don't know anything about the H&K stuff.
Best I can recommend is like anything one change at a time.
Ya it's a lot of tear down & reassembly but it's a easy gun to tear apart.
And the Lee lower is just as easy.
I made a vid but my phone is so potato it's not even bearable to watch.
Might try another vid tomorrow with the wife's phone hers is newer by a few years.
I'll post it if I do, now the not so fun part of cleaning the gun & can.
Here is to hoping for a 3 position AK and AUG SS.
I'm gonna buy more of these. I see that in my future for sure.
A&S Conversions
UZI Talk Life Member
A big weakness of the roller locked system in the HK 9 series guns is the extractor springs. If there is a misfeed and the extractor was over tensioned, the extractor spring is junk. Bending the extractor spring back to original shape, once it has been bent it won’t stay in shape. The right thing to do is replace it.
To check the extractor spring, use the cocking handle to pull the bolt face back so it is flush with the back of the ejection port. Reach your thumb inside and try to pull the extractor away from the center of the bolt. If you can move the extractor at all, the spring is not giving the proper tension and should be replaced. The steel surfaced rifle caliber extractor springs are stronger and less expensive than the copper coated MP5 springs and work just as well.
The concern I have with using an AR hammer is the mechanical advantage increase in torque using a squared off AR hammer with the squared off HK style bolt carrier. The HK carrier was designed to be used with a rounded hammer. When Colt came up with their 9mm conversion for the M16, there were problems with the hammer pins breaking due to the mechanical advantage of the squared off 9mm bolt with the squared AR hammer. The original M16 carrier has a “ramp” underneath the firing pin, to slow the stress on the hammer by slowing down how fast the hammer comes back when it is cocked. The M16 9mm bolt did not have this ramped cocking surface. I wonder if the pounding that the fire control of the roller locked SS conversion is being caused by the lack of a ramp on the cocking surface of the HK style carrier?
Scott
To check the extractor spring, use the cocking handle to pull the bolt face back so it is flush with the back of the ejection port. Reach your thumb inside and try to pull the extractor away from the center of the bolt. If you can move the extractor at all, the spring is not giving the proper tension and should be replaced. The steel surfaced rifle caliber extractor springs are stronger and less expensive than the copper coated MP5 springs and work just as well.
The concern I have with using an AR hammer is the mechanical advantage increase in torque using a squared off AR hammer with the squared off HK style bolt carrier. The HK carrier was designed to be used with a rounded hammer. When Colt came up with their 9mm conversion for the M16, there were problems with the hammer pins breaking due to the mechanical advantage of the squared off 9mm bolt with the squared AR hammer. The original M16 carrier has a “ramp” underneath the firing pin, to slow the stress on the hammer by slowing down how fast the hammer comes back when it is cocked. The M16 9mm bolt did not have this ramped cocking surface. I wonder if the pounding that the fire control of the roller locked SS conversion is being caused by the lack of a ramp on the cocking surface of the HK style carrier?
Scott
Alaska_Shooter
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2004
- Messages
- 433
Shrike and AK SS porn from yesterday. The M16 and other MGs stayed in the case or the safe.
Semi AR lowers with SSs have made it so I no longer need to swap M16 uppers, change buffers/springs, etc. So very cool
The AK stock still sucks to shoot
Semi AR lowers with SSs have made it so I no longer need to swap M16 uppers, change buffers/springs, etc. So very cool
The AK stock still sucks to shoot
Good to know about the ejector spring Scott I'll pick up some spares.
Don't think I damaged it though since the gun is back to 100% function after getting it sorted.
I'll also take a look at the Colt 9mm hammer in my 9mm Colt carbine and compare it to the regular AR hammers. Maybe even try it in the SP5.
GMR is now selling a lighter rear bolt extension.
With the weight listed I'll have to weigh mine and compare the difference.
Price is also 20 dollars more from when I ordered mine. 90 $ compared to my 70$ original heavier extension.
Guys I went to order more SS stuff and they are sold out for the next week until after Jan 1st. Kinda makes me sad. I want one in my SBR AR.
and the Colt 9mm carbine.
Alaskan shooter nice vid.
Ya wire stocks and underfolders are not the best for shooting. I've always avoided them after trying them.
Seeing you constant doubles I'll probabably order one of those tonight instead of waiting for the 3 position.
These things are pretty fun and was a breeze to get running in the SP5
Don't think I damaged it though since the gun is back to 100% function after getting it sorted.
I'll also take a look at the Colt 9mm hammer in my 9mm Colt carbine and compare it to the regular AR hammers. Maybe even try it in the SP5.
GMR is now selling a lighter rear bolt extension.
With the weight listed I'll have to weigh mine and compare the difference.
Price is also 20 dollars more from when I ordered mine. 90 $ compared to my 70$ original heavier extension.
Guys I went to order more SS stuff and they are sold out for the next week until after Jan 1st. Kinda makes me sad. I want one in my SBR AR.
and the Colt 9mm carbine.
Alaskan shooter nice vid.
Ya wire stocks and underfolders are not the best for shooting. I've always avoided them after trying them.
Seeing you constant doubles I'll probabably order one of those tonight instead of waiting for the 3 position.
These things are pretty fun and was a breeze to get running in the SP5
A&S Conversions
UZI Talk Life Member
How old is your Colt 9mm carbine? The Colt SP1 series used standard 0.154” fire control pins. Starting with the Sporter line, Colt used 0.169” diameter fire control pins. That continued during the Nation AWB and beyond. As I recall, it wasn’t until Colt lost their Government M4 contract to FN that Colt reverted back to using standard 0.154” fire control pins.
So unless you purchased your Colt 9mm carbine in the last 10 years, that lower probably has to larger diameter fire control pins. You might be able to use the contour of the 9mm hammer as a guide to modify your current hammer in the HK AR trigger frame. Just a thought.
Scott
ETA, that it is the extractor spring, not the ejector spring that can be damaged by a misfeed hyperextending the extractor spring. Once the extractor spring has been bent, bending it back will only last a couple of mags, if you are lucky. Mark your mags. If one causes misdeeds, take it out of use and possibly use a reliable mag as a guide to modify the bad mag back to reliable.
I have always wondered why HK never fixed this problem until the 23E. But they never went back and fixed the extractor spring problem with the rest of the roller locked bolts. HK recommends a deep cleaning at 1,000 rounds of use including removing the extractor, cleaning the bottom side and the extractor features where the extractor sits. Also it is easy to damage the extractor spring while removing it. HK recommends replacing the extractor spring at the end of the deep cleaning of the bolt.
Scott
So unless you purchased your Colt 9mm carbine in the last 10 years, that lower probably has to larger diameter fire control pins. You might be able to use the contour of the 9mm hammer as a guide to modify your current hammer in the HK AR trigger frame. Just a thought.
Scott
ETA, that it is the extractor spring, not the ejector spring that can be damaged by a misfeed hyperextending the extractor spring. Once the extractor spring has been bent, bending it back will only last a couple of mags, if you are lucky. Mark your mags. If one causes misdeeds, take it out of use and possibly use a reliable mag as a guide to modify the bad mag back to reliable.
I have always wondered why HK never fixed this problem until the 23E. But they never went back and fixed the extractor spring problem with the rest of the roller locked bolts. HK recommends a deep cleaning at 1,000 rounds of use including removing the extractor, cleaning the bottom side and the extractor features where the extractor sits. Also it is easy to damage the extractor spring while removing it. HK recommends replacing the extractor spring at the end of the deep cleaning of the bolt.
Scott
The Colt 9mm carbine is just over 3 years old bought it during Colt/CZs last run of them for 800 NIB.
So far haven't damaged any springs the SP5 is running like a prom queen with her dress tore off and boringly reliable like all my other guns now
That I got the SS sorted.
Oh I been meaning to mention this so others don't make this mistake.
The Umbrella Corp. AR pistol grip does NOT fit on the Lee lower.
I'll have to stick it on something else but I bought it just for the Lee lower.
So far haven't damaged any springs the SP5 is running like a prom queen with her dress tore off and boringly reliable like all my other guns now
That I got the SS sorted.
Oh I been meaning to mention this so others don't make this mistake.
The Umbrella Corp. AR pistol grip does NOT fit on the Lee lower.
I'll have to stick it on something else but I bought it just for the Lee lower.
Alaska_Shooter
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2004
- Messages
- 433
The installation took some time but it’s been zero problems and very reliable. I’ve only had two malfs that were mag related. My good metal mags are at a different location. I look forward to trying a metal drum
ericthered
UZI Talk Supporter
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2020
- Messages
- 513
I have a cmmg 22 conversion. I use bore buddy weights, buffer, extractor spring, charging handle insert, buffer plug, and super safety trip. The trip is adjustable, it is a very stupid design to make it adjustable. Just a micro screw that needs unscrewed quite a bit. Mine walked off.
All of that was fairly expensive for a inaccureate 22 that is reliable with select ammunition.
Thanks for your feedback.
Do you think the inaccuracy may be because it is a conversion rather than a dedicated .22 upper?
If you used the adjustable feature to get it dialed in for your setup and then used some other more permanent method (epoxy, welding, solder, etc.) to fix it in place, do you think the setup would be more viable? Does anyone make a more rugged trip?
Truth be told, I don’t ever shoot .22, but after recently playing with a full-auto airsoft gun, it made me think maybe I’m missing out.
If you want accurate 22 LR you will need a 1/16 twist barrel to start.
Preferably chambered in 22LR instead of a insert where the bullet has to make the jump from the insert to the rifling.
Also since that is the proper twist for 22LR it really reduces the chance of a baffle strike shooting suppressed.
Why I was asking about the DPMS 22 uppers.
I plan on looking at it at some point but the coyote contest is here until Feb. 3rd and since I paid to enter I plan on going alot like pretty much every night.
Preferably chambered in 22LR instead of a insert where the bullet has to make the jump from the insert to the rifling.
Also since that is the proper twist for 22LR it really reduces the chance of a baffle strike shooting suppressed.
Why I was asking about the DPMS 22 uppers.
I plan on looking at it at some point but the coyote contest is here until Feb. 3rd and since I paid to enter I plan on going alot like pretty much every night.
ericthered
UZI Talk Supporter
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2020
- Messages
- 513
I think the inaccuracy comes from using a 223 barrel for 22. Twist probably has a impact as well. Hard pressed to single shot a gopher at 100 yards... with a 6x scope. If i was to do it againg i would do a dedicated build.
I dont know if all conversions are this way (would guess yes). But mine leaks a lot of gas around the chamber insert and the barrel. Which I think contributes to the finnicky bit with the ammo.
I don't know of any other trip. Bore buddy has a non adjustable one, i dont know if it is any good.
The adjustment screw might be benefited from soldering it in or some such attachment method.
With near zero recoil and muzzle climb, it is an absolute blast to shoot. Can easily shoot singles.
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