Tenko 10-16 Function Questionnaire

[A&S Conversions]

No, I have not gun related traveled in three years. I would have liked to go. I have never been to the Creek. That money has gone into redesign and staying solvent. It is incredibly hard to make the simple mechanism run reliably with the M10 lower but not be able to run using zip ties, C-clamps, and angle iron. I have lost track of how many different designs we have tried and have failed. Either being able to be defeated or was not reliable.

Failure is not fun. I have not been shooting in months. I have plenty of ammo but it just brings up this whole situation. This whole experience has taken the fun out of shooting for me. Because I had hoped to patent the mechanism, that has limited the people I can talk to about it. One of my Beta Testers didn't get the shot at 76. He is now gone. I miss him. It has been a rough couple of years, especially this last one. It is all part of the risk of bringing a new design to the firearms market. Rare Breed Triggers gives me some hope. But that is probably years away.

Scott

 

[Galil#1]

Sorry to hear about your loss Scott.
It's the way of all flesh, and the only one absolute thing we are all guaranteed for certain.

Evil rotten Chicoms should be wiped off the face of the earth for giving the entire world Covid-19 and their many other chronic crimes against humanity. - But everyone is so stupid and scared shitless of them...

I just read up on RBT, yes they must Win/2A because all the miserable communist turds (NFA/FOPA/GCA +++) are out of control and already been long time destroying our country etc. via "Death of a thousand cuts concept."
Words are not enough for this outrage insane communist takeover... only thing to do is move forward, fight on, and not allow 2022 and 2024 to be stolen again. Hang in there Scott!

 

[Uniquesnd]

Why not release it and just put a disclaimer? I think asking for permission for an accessory for a machine gun is goofy honestly. I would just pay now and see what happens down the road. look at bump stocks that was a good 8-10 years before the door was slammed shut. I would not be mad if I could enjoy this upper for a few years before I had to destroy it which may never happen anyways.

 

[Deerhurst]

Get the shot, don't get the shot. Who cares? At 76 if there are any other issues even a nasty flu can take you out. I recently lost a shooting buddy too. I got the china flu from him. His resulting pneumonia took him out. That was only a few months after loosing another buddy to suicide due to this bullshit. What I'd give for people to just live their lives as they see fit to.

Great people never gave up. If they did Edison would never had given us the lightbulb, Tesla, Washington, you name it. Thank you for your continual effort.

Unique, do you really think people even care about the bumpfire stock ban? With all the 3D printers out there folks have been making their own. Same with binary and FARTs. Hell, I can print a DIAS for $0.30.

I hope RBT is victorious and I hope that the Tenko will come to light.

I do wonder what's up with the Lage and the Ultimac.

 

[Uniquesnd]

Deerhurst, I certainly do not care which is why I am saying release it! It’s an accessory let the ATF figure it out on there own. 50 BMG uppers where out for ever and same thing took them awhile to make it the firearm.

 

[Deerhurst]

The 50 upper thing is as much BS as this is and the bumpfire stock stuff.

My 3D printer goes burr, Burr, burr. Looking for a milling machine too. Muahahaha!

 

[A&S Conversions]

Why not release it and just put a disclaimer? I think asking for permission for an accessory for a machine gun is goofy honestly. I would just pay now and see what happens down the road. look at bump stocks that was a good 8-10 years before the door was slammed shut. I would not be mad if I could enjoy this upper for a few years before I had to destroy it which may never happen anyways.

The whole point of submission is to avoid litigation. I was quoted two years and $100,000.00 to sue the ATF. I can only imagine what the retainer would be to facedown the ATF. I have immense respect for the owner of Rare Breed Triggers. I just don't have the resources required. I had to borrow $50,000.00 to finish the development of the Tenko. I am paying $1,000.00 per month for the loan. If you have that $100,000.00 for the litigation we'll give up 49% of A&S Conversions L.L.C. and we can stand with Rare Breed.

BTW, while waiting for the determination of the aluminum version we did offer the Tenko with a release form possibility. Three buyers expressed interest in that possibility. Now we have gotten the determination that the aluminium version is a machinegun with an AR upper. So we had to destroy part of the system so we wouldn't have any Post Sample machineguns around.

Talk is cheap. Right now we have invested half our net worth and my family's future in this endeavor. I would love to "roll the dice" and go toe to toe with the ATF in court. But what is best for my family is to try to address the concerns addressed in the determination and try to get something to pass so all this investment is not a total loss.

Scott
Manager A&S Conversions L.L.C.

 

[Galil#1]

Many are... anxious, greedy, horney, 2A patriotic, etc. for the beloved M10 to gain centerfire rifle capabilities; however, the Alien Trans Fools will totally crush the honest Americans... so as usual, Scott is exactly on point with his very real and sound reasoning. He even offered a tangible solution at hand to lawfully/nicely fight these ratchet gestapo... but don't have $100K and 99.8% of the folks reading this don't as well for this cause. Scott can use some Divine Intervention & Will him the very best!

 

[Fishman]

BTW, while waiting for the determination of the aluminum version we did offer the Tenko with a release form possibility. Three buyers expressed interest in that possibility.

I honestly believe the pricepoint is why that number is so low.

I'll buy one right now, but not for $3,000. I'd pay that much for a Lage Max10/15 or an Ultimac right now, with no determination. People also dont know how your adapter works. They dont know how reliable it is, or how well it will be supported in the future. I really dont think its the determination status that's holding people back.

 

[A&S Conversions]

I honestly believe the pricepoint is why that number is so low.

I'll buy one right now, but not for $3,000. I'd pay that much for a Lage Max10/15 or an Ultimac right now, with no determination. People also dont know how your adapter works. They dont know how reliable it is, or how well it will be supported in the future. I really dont think its the determination status that's holding people back.

That is why we will have to wait for a positive determination. We have filled for patent protection of the mechanism. So we have not made public how our mechanism works. I am glad that there wasn't more that wanted to buy without the determination. Those units would have been destroyed. We are working on modification of the adapter such that it would be much more difficult to get it to fire with a vice, C-clamp angle iron, and zip ties.

Trust me, I get $3,000 is a lot of money. If we can actually bring this adapter to market, being able to change uppers/calibers using standard AR-15/M16 upper receivers would have great utility. I would think that such functionality would tend to bring those that don't have $25,000 to $30,000 for a M16 registered receiver to look into the Mac style registered receiver.

Scott

 

[Galil#1]

Exactly Scott! Some people don't seem to get it.... and than nitpick the best of new/pending new innovations for the MAC Family of SMGs. No worries, such views are in the far few minority IMHO.
Folks like you who have committed so much time, effort, and money, clearly should be supported/encouraged as much as possible! IF Richard and Sam would of listened to negative naysayers, they would likely not be the success they are in the MAC M10 M11 world, again IMHO that's all. Fight on and always keeping moving forward Sir! I would pay $3K for a great product that can make the M10 have 5.56, 7.62x39 capabilities... unless I win the lottery... forgetabout $30K+ AR-15s/M-16s MGs.

 

[Gaujo]

I think this has be covered but just to double check, did the second negative determination negate the prior positive determination for the 3d printed model?

Sorry to hear about your friend passing. Most of my friends and acquaintances that didn't get the vaccine have gotten covid at this point.

 

[A&S Conversions]

Yes, the ATF said that the first determination was invalid because they supposedly didn't fire the 3D printed version. I had checked the timing but had not fired it. When it came back there was residue from being fired. Of course I didn't document the residue because I had expected them to fire it.

It would not be economical to build more of the 3D units as it was custom made for my original M10 receiver. Changing the dimensions to fit specific lower would require shipping, measuring, and modifying the program, print it, and check it.

Scott

 

[nklf]

Scott any updates on the redesign of the Tenko adapter? Hopefully it will not take as long to get a determination on the resubmission as it did the first time around. I know this has been a strain on you but hopefully you are able to keep this moving forward. It really sucks the way the government of the People treats someone trying to bring a firearm related devise to market.

 

[A&S Conversions]

First, thank you for the kind words. This has been the most difficult challenge of my working life. I hope we are in the final phase of testing for the resubmition. We will be testing tomorrow. We have held off posting as we have been here ( having a design that we think will be solid in operation but can't be fired with zip ties, angle iron and C-clamps) several times before. I don't want to get my hopes up too high. Our resent updates have been very similar, working on it but not there yet. We have been holding off until I have actual news to report. I am sorry that I don't have actual forward progress to report. Hopefully we will have real news to report soon.

 

[Deerhurst]

We are all probably just as excited as you are about it!


I wish you luck and a swift submission!