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Thread: Braces subject to NFA

  1. #21
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    If the SCOTUS tears apart the EOs that Biden is doing the same as Trump's there will be little left Biden can do without congress.

  2. #22
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    I'm a bit of a purist, so the braces never appealed to me. After some consideration, I went the SBR route for my short ARs and formerly, AK pistols.

    I do understand the appeal to them, and other things that I'm not interested in (like bumptocks), but regardless, it is unfortunate they fall under scrutiny for those who enjoy them.

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    My personal biggest adversity to SBR is having to request permission to cross state borders. Now i dont travel much at all out of state, but i dont like the idea of having to get permission to carry my personal property around.

    Oh, and post script. I really want a ruger charger... i would settle for the full size however.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by kanewtervalve View Post
    If the SCOTUS tears apart the EOs that Biden is doing the same as Trump's there will be little left Biden can do without congress.
    There is no EO for SCOTUS to "tear apart" .....all the Administration has to do is pressure the DOJ/BATFE to do a reclassification.... and thats it....no EO or legislation required.....

  5. #25
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    Can't be put on NFA (with cost) by EO, unless they are reclassified as stocks by ATF; only Congress has the power to levy taxes.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Villafuego View Post
    There is no EO for SCOTUS to "tear apart" .....all the Administration has to do is pressure the DOJ/BATFE to do a reclassification.... and thats it....no EO or legislation required.....
    That's kind of my take on it too. It's unclear what the mechanism will be for some of these things; some are apparently "leave it to the agencies to set rules and policies" (i.e. bumpstocks) and EO's for things that can't be done that way.

    Which takes me back to the (sort of) original question of 'if you have a braced pistol now, does it gain value or become unsellable for all practical purposes?'

    I suspect - just my opinion - post BATF ruling newly-made braced pistols are going to be more expensive and I would think less desirable due to that and the long transfer time.

    Maybe such items will greatly increase in value right up to the time when declaration / registration arrives, assuming a free 'grandfather clause' is applied.

    After that period used items without ahem a properly dated Bill of Sale become far less valuable.

    To be transparent, I am really curious as I have a quality AR lower that can go either way and I'm wondering what the best course of action is when the day comes that I have to decide / declare - or just let it sit and become a future rifle.

    Similarly, my Ruger 10/22 Charger. If it becomes a burden to transfer and loses value by registering it as a SBR, then maybe remove the brace and let it be as it was born. But if the opposite is true, then register it.

    No, it's not all about money, but I have plenty of toys already and have an eye on what I leave behind for my heirs and what I burden them with.
    My name is actually Scott and I really do live in Texas.

    I know, not very creative but it is factual.

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  7. #27
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    Why do you assume you’ll be able to keep your pistols or get a free SBR out of it? That’s not what happened with bumpstocks. Precedent matters (as I repeated numerous time when the bumpstock debates were had on this forum). Allowing regulatory bodies to make law through regulation is not legal. However, if the public allows it, it stands. Remember machine Guns are very few in numbers (far eclipsed by the number of pistol braces). Fudd mentality (I only need a gun to hunt, so I don’t care if they confiscate Machineguns), is no different than a Machinegun owner saying, I have a machine gun, so who cares if they take pistol braces or bumpstocks. Our cute little stamps don’t mean Shit to a tyrannical government. Better we gun owners back each other up, whether it affects us personally or not. Not doing so is very Short sighted, Naive, and Frankly Selfish IMO...

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Offmarksman View Post
    Why do you assume you’ll be able to keep your pistols or get a free SBR out of it? That’s not what happened with bumpstocks. Precedent matters (as I repeated numerous time when the bumpstock debates were had on this forum). Allowing regulatory bodies to make law through regulation is not legal. However, if the public allows it, it stands. Remember machine Guns are very few in numbers (far eclipsed by the number of pistol braces). Fudd mentality (I only need a gun to hunt, so I don’t care if they confiscate Machineguns), is no different than a Machinegun owner saying, I have a machine gun, so who cares if they take pistol braces or bumpstocks. Our cute little stamps don’t mean Shit to a tyrannical government. Better we gun owners back each other up, whether it affects us personally or not. Not doing so is very Short sighted, Naive, and Frankly Selfish IMO...
    I don't assume anything.

    The prematurely published and then withdrawn BATF letter a month or so ago generated several possibilities, 'Grandfathering' being one.

    Calm down; your anger should be directed to our common opponents.
    My name is actually Scott and I really do live in Texas.

    I know, not very creative but it is factual.

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  9. #29
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    Not angry, just very disappointed in the shortsightedness of many comments I see on this and previous (but very similar) discussions.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Offmarksman View Post
    Not angry, just very disappointed in the shortsightedness of many comments I see on this and previous (but very similar) discussions.
    Read Xidens page before he got elected. He wants all ARs as NFA.

    It was common talk to think they would be “grandfathered if registered, most probably free of charge”. That was the talk.

    Same thought now for pistols since there are so many out there, multitudes sold with braces new from major makers?

    Chill? This isn’t the political forum.

  11. #31
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    First off, bumpstocks were re-classified as MGs, which cannot be legally owned if made after May 1986. Once they were ruled MGs by ATF your only alternative was to divest yourself of them or risk being charged with possession of an illegal machine gun.

    Arm braces making a handgun an SBR is a totally different animal, as SBRs can currently be made and registered legally. All they can do is claim an arm brace is actually a stock, so worst case scenario you remove the brace from your handgun and it reverts back to a handgun. Just like if you removed the actual stock from an SBR made from a handgun, once the firearm no longer meets the definition of SBR it isn't one.

    That leaves you with a legal handgun and a piece of plastic that is now the same item, legally speaking, as a Magpul MOE stock. Both are legal to own, sell, or give away. The only illegal act would be installing one on a handgun. Future resale value would likely be nill, as millions would be available with no real use for them outside of handicapped shooters or whatever use the new regs would allow, if any. Using one as a stock on a rifle, SBR or not, would not be likely either as a real stock would work better for the purpose.

    That is just addressing the brace issue, if they come after AR-based handguns and the like who knows what will happen.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Villafuego View Post
    There is no EO for SCOTUS to "tear apart" .....all the Administration has to do is pressure the DOJ/BATFE to do a reclassification.... and thats it....no EO or legislation required.....
    It will end up in the courts just like bump stocks, why do you think he hasn't done it already, its going to be a different animal because braces don't imitate full auto. 80% kits are more
    likely to be reclassified than braces.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimshady View Post
    First off, bumpstocks were re-classified as MGs, which cannot be legally owned if made after May 1986. Once they were ruled MGs by ATF your only alternative was to divest yourself of them or risk being charged with possession of an illegal machine gun.

    Arm braces making a handgun an SBR is a totally different animal, as SBRs can currently be made and registered legally. All they can do is claim an arm brace is actually a stock, so worst case scenario you remove the brace from your handgun and it reverts back to a handgun. Just like if you removed the actual stock from an SBR made from a handgun, once the firearm no longer meets the definition of SBR it isn't one.

    That leaves you with a legal handgun and a piece of plastic that is now the same item, legally speaking, as a Magpul MOE stock. Both are legal to own, sell, or give away. The only illegal act would be installing one on a handgun. Future resale value would likely be nill, as millions would be available with no real use for them outside of handicapped shooters or whatever use the new regs would allow, if any. Using one as a stock on a rifle, SBR or not, would not be likely either as a real stock would work better for the purpose.

    That is just addressing the brace issue, if they come after AR-based handguns and the like who knows what will happen.
    So the ATF is who writes law? I guess I missed that episode of school house rock.

    I also fail to see ANY politics in my comments. I
    Am simply pointing out that yesterday’s bumpstocks, become today’s pistol brace, and tomorrow’s (fill in the blank) if you let an unelected bureaucrat determine law without going through the legal process.
    Last edited by Offmarksman; 04-10-2021 at 09:56 AM.

  14. #34
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    Time for a NFA amnesty. MG, SBR, AOW, SBS, everything. Open the book one more time.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by timkel View Post
    Time for a NFA amnesty. MG, SBR, AOW, SBS, everything. Open the book one more time.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KgAilTTZnQ

    I like the way you think!

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by timkel View Post
    Time for a NFA amnesty. MG, SBR, AOW, SBS, everything. Open the book one more time.
    You really want me to get a nervous breakdown after going a week without sleep filing on every wire coat hanger and chunk of aluminum scrap I can find, huh?

  17. #37
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    Ha! If they (they never will but fun fantasy) opened the books for registering a mg... the wait times would be years! And yes i would be hanging clothes on registered mg parts

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