Reising SMG on GunBroker - Las Vegas PD gun
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MuzzleFlash
UZI Talk Life Member
On a form 4. Any of you guys without an FFL who are thinking yea, but $400 in taxes to get it here, wake up!!
You should get your C&R FFL for an investment of $30 and 30 minutes to fill out the form.
Hell, buy the gun and have him hold the transfer for a few weeks while you wait for your FFL to arrive in the mail. And you save $200 on transfer taxes!
You should get your C&R FFL for an investment of $30 and 30 minutes to fill out the form.
Hell, buy the gun and have him hold the transfer for a few weeks while you wait for your FFL to arrive in the mail. And you save $200 on transfer taxes!
Jmacken37
Mr. Miata, UZI Talk Life Member,
The discounts I've gotten from Brownells, Midway, etc. have more than paid for the cost of the license. The ability to get an NFA MG delivered to my door...priceless.
Compensator is missing a piece or two on that gun.
Jake
Compensator is missing a piece or two on that gun.
Jake
texasvwnut
UZI Talk Life Member
coyle311 -
Tell me about NFA regulations in MO. I was kinda thinking about looking into a job in Kansas City, but found Kansas was not an NFA state. It seems Missouri does allow NFA, but is it only C&R? How are the CLEOs about signing in Missouri?
Tell me about NFA regulations in MO. I was kinda thinking about looking into a job in Kansas City, but found Kansas was not an NFA state. It seems Missouri does allow NFA, but is it only C&R? How are the CLEOs about signing in Missouri?
coyle311
UZI Talk Life Member
We can buy any NFA( not only C&R), but you have to have a C&R license (I don't know why, I just do what they tell me). CLEO sign offs all depend on the Department. I'm lucky enough to live in a county that doesn't have a problem signing off, but I know some Departments closer into St. Louis have probs. I would post where I was thinking about moving to and someone here would probably know.
Vegas SMG
UZI Talk Life Member,
Very Interesting. All the guns I've ever seen from Las Vegas, NV have had the CCSD markings, (Clark County Sheriff's Office). They later revamped the entire department and became the Las Vegas Metropolition Police Department. In fact, I think AZ Paul's S&W76 is marked CCSD as is Uzi Talk member Klye's Thompson. I've never seen or heard of that particular Las Vegas PD marking before.... Could it possibly be from Las Vegas New Mexico?
Is a C&R FFL really that easy and fast ? I thought ATF was making it really difficult for kitchen table FFLs - zoning requirements, security system, etc. Is the C&R different ?MuzzleFlash said:
Also, don't you still need to be a class 3 SOT to do NFA stuff or does C&R status null that requirement ? Any info is appreciated, but I am going to get off my butt and start reading up on this !
texasvwnut
UZI Talk Life Member
C&R FFLs are easy. They are not for the purpose of doing business, just allow the holder to purchase C&R weapons for their personal collection. C&R FFLs allow the transfer of ALL C&R to yourself including NFA stuff. In fact I got my C&R FFL in my business name so I can transfer in a C&R NFA items to my business without a CLEO signoff.
MuzzleFlash
UZI Talk Life Member
Yes it is different.
It is against the law to use a dealer FFL solely as a means to collect guns. Likewise it is illegal to use a C&R FFL to engage in the business of dealing C&R guns.
Since the C&R FFL is a license for collecting, not doing business, zoning is usually never a problem. There are no storage requirements. You don't have to mess with 4473's if you sell your gun, but you do need to keep a bound book. There is no fingerprinting requirement when you get the license. Unlike commercial FFLs, you do not have to submit to a search of your premesis without a warrant. If they do a compliance inspection, it is your choice under law to make them do it at their offices.
There is no SOT for C&R FFLs. You still have to pay the $200 tax on all C&R NFA transfers to and from your collection. If you have an individual license as most do, you have to get fingerprinted and get the CLEO signoff too. Sometimes the C&R license helps get the CLEO to sign. It gives him some ass cover, I guess. I always list it on my F4s even when the gun isn't a C&R.
Unlike regular FFLs who must conduct their business at a licensed premesis or at a gun show, you have no such restriction.
If you buy from an out-of-state non-SOT, you can save one F4 transfer and it's associated tax plus save on the transfer services fees of a local SOT. For instance, if your local dealer charges $75 for transfers, you just saved $275 + the F3 transfer time.
If buying from an out-of-state dealer, you save the time of the first transfer and whatever your dealer charges for transfers. Given the above scenario, that's $75 + F3 processing time.
If you buy from an in-state seller, it's pretty much the same as if you didn't have the license except, like all C&R transactions, you have to record it in your bound book. License or not, you are technically responsible for state sales/use taxes if applicable.
It is against the law to use a dealer FFL solely as a means to collect guns. Likewise it is illegal to use a C&R FFL to engage in the business of dealing C&R guns.
Since the C&R FFL is a license for collecting, not doing business, zoning is usually never a problem. There are no storage requirements. You don't have to mess with 4473's if you sell your gun, but you do need to keep a bound book. There is no fingerprinting requirement when you get the license. Unlike commercial FFLs, you do not have to submit to a search of your premesis without a warrant. If they do a compliance inspection, it is your choice under law to make them do it at their offices.
There is no SOT for C&R FFLs. You still have to pay the $200 tax on all C&R NFA transfers to and from your collection. If you have an individual license as most do, you have to get fingerprinted and get the CLEO signoff too. Sometimes the C&R license helps get the CLEO to sign. It gives him some ass cover, I guess. I always list it on my F4s even when the gun isn't a C&R.
Unlike regular FFLs who must conduct their business at a licensed premesis or at a gun show, you have no such restriction.
If you buy from an out-of-state non-SOT, you can save one F4 transfer and it's associated tax plus save on the transfer services fees of a local SOT. For instance, if your local dealer charges $75 for transfers, you just saved $275 + the F3 transfer time.
If buying from an out-of-state dealer, you save the time of the first transfer and whatever your dealer charges for transfers. Given the above scenario, that's $75 + F3 processing time.
If you buy from an in-state seller, it's pretty much the same as if you didn't have the license except, like all C&R transactions, you have to record it in your bound book. License or not, you are technically responsible for state sales/use taxes if applicable.
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ptrthgr8
UZI Talk Life Member, , FFL/C&R
buzzer said:
I got my C&R license in about 3 weeks from the time I sent off the paperwork to the time it arrived in my mailbox. When I renewed it (last year), it took about 5 weeks for the new copy to arrive. It's been taking a little longer than in the past for new licenses and renewals to be received, but I think that's mainly because so many folks are getting them now. Still, most folks seem to be getting theirs in less than 8 weeks.
The only time a C&R license will help with with an NFA purchase is when you're buying a C&R rated NFA weapon from a dealer out of state. Without the license, you'd have to pay the $200 transfer tax from the out of state dealer to your in-state dealer, then you'd have to pay another $200 transfer tax from your in-state dealer to you. With the C&R license in such a case, you simply pay the $200 transfer tax from the out of state dealer, he packages the weapon, and the C&R rated NFA weapon will arrive at your door. Not needing to pay the second transfer tax also means you can avoid going through the second transfer approval process... which probably means you'll also save another 6-8 weeks of impatient waiting.
When I purchased my Reising from an in-state dealer, I still had to pay the $200 transfer tax, so my license didn't help me in that case. I did add my C&R FFL number to the form (there's a section that asks if the transferee has an FFL of any sort); I'm not sure if it helped, but I'm sure it didn't hurt anything.
The C&R license is a great thing that typically pays for itself within a purchase or two. Of course, the C&R license makes spending money way too easy -- I've spent a lot more money in the last 7 years than I would have if I didn't have the C&R license in the first place... but such is life.
There's a lot of great info re: the C&R license over at surplusrifle.com:
http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting2005/howtogetyourcurionrelicffl03/index.asp
Cheers,
~ Greg ~
MuzzleFlash
UZI Talk Life Member
Actually, if the seller is a dealer and the buyer is unlicensed, the gun goes dealer to dealer tax free on a F3 and then dealer to buyer on a $200 F4. With the same seller but the buyer is a C&R, the buyer avoids the first tax free transfer and avoids any transfer fee the in-state SOT would charge. The C&R buyer really saves when the out-of-state seller is a non-SOT. Then he avoids the front-page F4 + $200 tax to get it to his in-state SOT. He also avoids the SOT's transfer fee. The gun comes to him directly on a two sided tax paid F4.ptrthgr8 said:
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