Mac grenade

[ChuckB]

Will the lower need to be annealed, straightened, and hardened?

 

[ctbreitwieser]

Thanks for your all your input. Unfortunately it's something that happens so violently that its hard to recall the detail of how exactly it went down. While I find it hard to believe such a light load of only 3.4gr could cause so much destruction, and there be no bullets lodged in the barrel, with no damage to 12 inches worth of suppressor baffles, it does seem like has to be the most likely cause. I wouldn't think so normally, but the fact that it failed right before the final shot sure it makes it seem so. Either way, no one was hurt, my gun can be (should be) repairable, and I can walk away from it with a lesson to be even more mindful of my loading even when I thought I was doing it very cautiously already. Hopefully others will take something away from this and remember that no matter how confident you are in your loading abilities thy things can still go overlooked and/or go wrong.

 

[fq1234]

A question for those with a little more experience/knowledge. Doesn't it seem like a lot of damage for a double load in an open bolt scenario? I would expect the excess energy to go towards throwing the bolt back faster and also escaping out the ejection port. Wouldn't it be more likely that the energy causing the barrel eruption would have to come from a second bullet encountering a lodged bullet? I am far from an expert but that's how I am seeing it.

edit - posted without refreshing to see prior posts

 

[Jack007]

To me the key word here is RELOADS. I stay far away from them. I know it could happen with kind of ammo.

Sorry, but I concur.
I've shot thousands and thousands of WWB right off the Mao Mart shelf and have had ZERO issues.
You couldn't pay me enough money to run a single reload in my PS MAC no matter WHO did the loading.
But, its a free country (for now) so to each their own.
Jack

 

[HK45]

Sorry, but I concur.
I've shot thousands and thousands of WWB right off the Mao Mart shelf and have had ZERO issues.
You couldn't pay me enough money to run a single reload in my PS MAC no matter WHO did the loading.
But, its a free country (for now) so to each their own.
Jack

My experience has been the exact opposite. I've had several squibs with WWB, but no failures of any kind with my reloads.

Right now I'm shooting up a 1000 round case of WWB in my HK pistols, then I'll reload them for use in my MAC-10/45.
I'd rather blow up a 900 dollar pistol than a 4000 dollar irreplaceable full auto.

 

[Concorde]

I think it's "different" when the reloads you're shooting have been made with your own hands... you know exactly what you've got and the attention paid in putting them together. I trust my own reloads more than I trust certain factory ammo.

 

[medphys]

I think it's "different" when the reloads you're shooting have been made with your own hands... you know exactly what you've got and the attention paid in putting them together. I trust my own reloads more than I trust certain factory ammo.

Agreed.

 

[zipakna]

i wont touch WWB. i have seen everything over the last 20 years with WWB. no primer, no powder, primer falls out, bullet falls out, primer in sideways, bullet in sideways, primer in upside down, bullet in upside down............

I think it's "different" when the reloads you're shooting have been made with your own hands... you know exactly what you've got and the attention paid in putting them together. I trust my own reloads more than I trust certain factory ammo.

+1

 

[thompson4433]

OP, let me make some suggestions regarding your reloading technique:

1. Use a bulky power that will spill all over the floor if you try to double charge the case. Alliant Unique is a good choice for 9mm.

2. Never have more than one powder canister out on the bench at one time.

3. Get a good quality powder measure.

4. Pick up an empty case, drop the powder charge into it, eyeball the powder charge, stick a bullet on top and seat the bullet. All in one go.
Do it that way and you'll never make a mistake ever.

5. Don't use loading blocks. I can never understand why people use loading blocks. You have to pick up the case and stick it in the block. then take it out of the block. Why not just stick the case under the powder measure and then seat the bullet?

I used a loading blocks until I skipped a row of cases while charging the powder. Then I threw mine away. then I realized it was a waste of time anyway.

6. don't measure every charge, it's unneeded. weigh ever 25th charge from the measure if you're paranoid about it. weighing every charge is for bench rest shooters.

 

[hfoster223]

I've had two squibs with my M11/9. The 1st one, I was to much of a green horn and just racked the bolt back after a jam and ka-boom, bolt slams back with brass blown out of the side, no damage to the gun.
2nd squib was with same gun a year or so later, shooting full auto, after the 3 or 4 round, ka-boom, no damage, but if someone would have been standing to my right, it could have been a different story.

I tell everyone who shoots, no one stands to the right of the full auto and if any kind of a jam happens, feed problem, anything, DO NOT RACK THE BOLT BACK, stop and get a cleaning rod to verify the barrel is clear.
I'm using a Dillion 650 with the powder check, but after seeing those pictures, I'm a little more anxious about shooting my reloads through my NFA guns.

 

[9mmsubgun-m11]

A question for those with a little more experience/knowledge. Doesn't it seem like a lot of damage for a double load in an open bolt scenario? I would expect the excess energy to go towards throwing the bolt back faster and also escaping out the ejection port. Wouldn't it be more likely that the energy causing the barrel eruption would have to come from a second bullet encountering a lodged bullet? I am far from an expert but that's how I am seeing it.

edit - posted without refreshing to see prior posts

One thing to consider with the damage done to the upper is the original style barrels are not as robust as say Richards barrels.

 

[Ericoak]

I've had two squibs with my M11/9. The 1st one, I was to much of a green horn and just racked the bolt back after a jam and ka-boom, bolt slams back with brass blown out of the side, no damage to the gun.
2nd squib was with same gun a year or so later, shooting full auto, after the 3 or 4 round, ka-boom, no damage, but if someone would have been standing to my right, it could have been a different story.

I tell everyone who shoots, no one stands to the right of the full auto and if any kind of a jam happens, feed problem, anything, DO NOT RACK THE BOLT BACK, stop and get a cleaning rod to verify the barrel is clear.
I'm using a Dillion 650 with the powder check, but after seeing those pictures, I'm a little more anxious about shooting my reloads through my NFA guns.

After every jam you do that? That is pretty anal.

 

[hfoster223]

Yep, but its more of a safety issue with me and my son, than a concern about blowing up an expensive weapon, call it what you like, better safe than sorry, I prefer anal to careless.

 

[medphys]

Actually, pulling the bolt back should be the first thing you do.

 

[Ericoak]

Actually, pulling the bolt back should be the first thing you do.

Yea thats what I thought. I don't see how pulling and locking the bolt back would do anything but help.

Better to have some place for the gas to vent then have it sealed up like a bomb.

 

[hfoster223]

That round had to be fully loaded into the barrel to do that kind of damage, I guess it comes with the territory, just sad to see an NFA gun get beat up like that. Just be glad it wasn't an MP5.

 

[cockednlocked45]

That round had to be fully loaded into the barrel to do that kind of damage, I guess it comes with the territory, just sad to see an NFA gun get beat up like that. Just be glad it wasn't an MP5.

I dont think an mp5 would be so easy to repair if you could repair it?

 

[StooperZero]

I dont think an mp5 would be so easy to repair if you could repair it?

it's metal, with a little time you can fix anything.

 

[MrM4]

Your gun can be fixed, been there, twice. WWB once, 147 subs once. The lower can be squared and fixed. Mil the barrel off to free the bolt and you should be able to save everything except the Barrel / Upper receiver.


WWB

 

[UZI SBR AWC]

One thing to consider with the damage done to the upper is the original style barrels are not as robust as say Richards barrels.

What he says.. dont waste your time with 1 of them OE M11/9 barrel, buy a LAGE barrel and cut out front the way you want it.. I went so far for fun to cut an Uzi SMG barrel to spin into an M11/9 upper, whole lot stronger steel than that of an OE M11/9 black barrel